Azalea...nutrient deficient...?

fredman

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It has been growing strong all season (its autumn now), but the last few weeks its been yellowing....and the growth is stunted. I can only think its a nutrient deficiency...? Any ideas anybody? IMG_20240326_133322.jpg Soil is 70/30 mix of bonsai/ ericaceous potting soil.
Its "Conversation piece"....a Robin Hill hybrid.
 

Shibui

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Symptoms in younger leaves is indicative of a non mobile element. Usually Iron, zinc or Manganese. When elements the plants can move around are in short supply the plant takes from older leaves to feed young leaves so deficiency of Nitrogen, P and K are usually seen in older leaves.

Availability of the metallic elements in the soil depends on pH so the plant may show an Iron deficiency even though there's plenty in the fertiliser if the soil pH is high (alkaline) Azaleas prefer acid soils so if pH is a bit high they find it more difficult to get Iron, Zinc and Manganese than many other plants so can show deficiency when other nearby plants don't. Symptoms include green veins, yellow between veins, stunted leaves and curled margins - al of which appear to be showing on the photos. My thoughts are you have a deficiency of one or more of the above.
High pH is common when mains water is used because water authorities adjust pH of the water upward to prevent pipe degradation from acid water. You should be able to find reports on the water quality and composition on your local water authority website. It will list the pH they recorded at each test. Otherwise take a sample from the tap and get it tested. I think pool supply shops may do pH testing or you may be able to get a test kit or test strips to do your own monitoring.
Obviously using high pH water to water regularly will affect the soil pH in your pots. Acidifying fertiliser is used to counteract the water in some areas. It is available in the US, not sure whether such a product is sold down here or on your side of the ditch.

Questions that may help:
What soil mix are the azaleas in?
What fertiliser program has been used?
Have you checked soil pH?
Are any other plants affected? Any differences in fertiliser, soil, location, how long they've been in the pots, etc between healthy and affected plants?

Metallic element deficiency can be addressed in 2 ways:
1. Add more of the elements. Helps short term but doesn't address the real problem.
2. Change soil pH to make the current nutrients more available to the roots.
 

Glaucus

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Can you get some Fe2+ - EDTA or EDDHA? Aka chelated iron?
If you provide chelated iron, even a high pH isn't a problem for azaleas.
Can't say for sure if this is 100% an iron deficiency, but it is safe to overfertilize with chelated iron anyway.
 

brentwood

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Epsom salts can help azaleas with uptake issues - I'm hedging because I can't remember if it's copper or iron...

B
 

Deep Sea Diver

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Considering all the azaleas you have together, If this is a one off, most inclined to think it’s a relatively new root issue… vs a nutrient/pH issue.

If it’s not a one off… see above posts mention.

Cheers
DSD sends
 

Betula1

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You should be able to easily buy Sequestered Iron plant tonic (eg Sequestrene or other brands) which is watered into your soil. Its designed specifically to alleviate Iron deficiency in ericaceous plants so is safe to use when you follow the instructions.
 

fredman

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Apologies, I should've added I have a filter on my main water line...mainly for chlorides. I do check and adjust the Ph with hydrochloric acid...in a water tank which I water from.
Yes it seemed like an iron uptake problem to me to....which is strange considering it is in ericacious soil, and it has been growing strong all season long. Only now when its forming buds the problem appears.
I have just started feeding Sequestron and hopefully it makes the difference.
I'm going to add some chelated iron to.
Thanks everyone.
 

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I haven't checked this with many plants, but at least one time I checked the pH of the soil of a potted azalea that was in my azalea mix for at least a year and that had chlorosis. This by doing an extraction with RO water.
And the result came out that the pH was about 7 and the EC was really low, like 0.2 mS/cm. When I would do the same text with fresh mix, the pH is like 5.5 and the EC 1.2 mS/cm.
So even if you use ericaceous soil, the pH can slowly rise. Either because of the tap water or because of nutrient uptake and root exudates.
Soil pH is known to change as the plant grows. And almost always, it goes up.
 

fredman

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I haven't checked this with many plants, but at least one time I checked the pH of the soil of a potted azalea that was in my azalea mix for at least a year and that had chlorosis. This by doing an extraction with RO water.
And the result came out that the pH was about 7 and the EC was really low, like 0.2 mS/cm. When I would do the same text with fresh mix, the pH is like 5.5 and the EC 1.2 mS/cm.
So even if you use ericaceous soil, the pH can slowly rise. Either because of the tap water or because of nutrient uptake and root exudates.
Soil pH is known to change as the plant grows. And almost always, it goes up.
Interesting. It has been in this mix since only this spring....few months.
My Ph of the water I use is 6.5
So the silution would be to replant yearly...?
I can't afford Kanuma for all my azaleas. I have to make a sacrifice...and the mix of bonsai soil (or pumice) and ericacious soil is my best bet atm...
 

Shibui

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I meant which nutrient it helped absorb, think it's iron 😉
The sulphate part of Epsom salts is acidifying so that helps reduce pH which helps plants access all the metallic elements. In soil it's usually Fe that's deficient so I can see why it could be construed that MgSo4 would help with Iron.
The other part of Epsom salts is Magnesium which is also sometimes in short supply so MgSo4 gives 2 chances to correct possible deficiency.

Chelated iron also works in a similar manner. It is acidifying, thus helping to make any iron present more available and also boosts iron in the soil.

Good luck with the azaleas @fredman
 

Glaucus

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Chelated iron is immediately bioavailable iron. Since it is bound to the chelating agent, it won't form an insoluble salt and it also won't be oxidized into Fe3+, which is not bioavailable. Most iron ions around are Fe3+.
It allows azaleas to take up iron even at high pH level.

There's like two or three people that did their PhD on soil pH and nutrition of rhododendron under professor Rankin in Edinburgh.
Especially the doctoral thesis of dr.Maria V. Kaisheva lays out the basic understanding of nutrition in rhododendron.
It was originally thought that calcium toxicity was the reason rhododendron azaleas didn't do well in lime-rich high pH soils. But she shows it is more likely to be iron or manganese deficiency.
Caused by the effect of pH on the solubility and uptake of both.
Link here:
I assume the same would transfer to azaleas. But this research was really mostly on lepidote large leaf traditional rhododendron.

This also explains the research where when they used only nitrate fertilizer on rhododendron, in some studies the plants became chlorotic. But this deficiency was resolved by adding chelated iron.
Often cheap fertilizer has either urea or potassium nitrate. To take up nitrate, which is a negatively charged ion, the plant has to also expel a negative ion. This could be a OH- or HCO3-. Which would both neutralize H3O+ in the root zone, increasing the pH.
However, NH4+ uptake would require the plant to expel a H3O+. So ammonium sulphate is an acidifying fertilizer. Other options to lower soil pH are iron sulphate or magnesium sulphate/Epsom salt.
You could also use aluminium sulphate, but is is not recommended at all.
If you have a plot of soil and you want to reduce the pH, then elemental sulphur is best.
This video also explains it:
Of course none of these apply to potted azaleas/rhododendron.


I believe Sequestron is chelated iron.
Also check the values of iron and manganese in your tap water.
Not aware of commercial consumer-grade chelated manganese. But it is contained in the formulation of many brand fertilizers.
Maybe it would be easier to buy manganese sulfate. But, manganese toxicity is a thing. So beware of that as well. Not good to give your plants manganese toxicity when they were iron deficient.

Doing a repot and replacing all the old soil that 'went bad' (pH too high, compaction too large, fertilizer all rained out, etc) is also good.

Manganese deficiency is very similar to iron deficiency, as they both prevent chlorophyll production. But it is said that iron deficiency yellow colouring is more regular/symmetrical and with larger veins.

If there is plenty of insoluble iron and manganese present, but not available because of a high pH, and you both lower the pH and add more iron and manganese, then you could get manganese toxicity.
Plants need very little manganese, normally take it up easily, and are able to store it.

It is much more likely you have iron deficiency.
 
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Chuah

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It has been growing strong all season (its autumn now), but the last few weeks its been yellowing....and the growth is stunted. I can only think its a nutrient deficiency...? Any ideas anybody? View attachment 536483 Soil is 70/30 mix of bonsai/ ericaceous potting soil.
Its "Conversation piece"....a Robin Hill hybrid.
Although the leaves show chlorosis, the stunted leaves are most likely caused by chili thrips. This insect is very small, about 1 mm long, and is not very visible. When infested, new growths are stunted. It is not easily killed. I use Spinosad to get rid of chili thrips.

Attached is a page from the Satsuki Kenkyu Supplement showing stunted new growths caused by chili thrips.

1711771710322.jpeg
 

fredman

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Although the leaves show chlorosis, the stunted leaves are most likely caused by chili thrips. This insect is very small, about 1 mm long, and is not very visible. When infested, new growths are stunted. It is not easily killed. I use Spinosad to get rid of chili thrips.

Attached is a page from the Satsuki Kenkyu Supplement showing stunted new growths caused by chili thrips.

View attachment 537093
Thanks for that. Yeah I figured the stunting is a seperate issue. I sprayed something for thrips a week ago...and just covered everything again with a spray oil.
Will have to wait and see now. There still is another months growth ahead....actually more because they're in the poly tunnel. It's chilli out today...but they're nice and snug inside.
 
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