Selecting branches to cut when starting field grown clump style deciduous

[himmelich]

Hi I have had this eastern redbud tree growing under my garden bed since my son was born. Now it is 5 years old and I just transplanted it to a bucket. I have no idea what I am doing so forgive my ignorance of terminology etc. I am trying my best to figure it out and have watched a lot of videos but I am overwhelmed. I like the shape and form of the central trunk but I do not know where to go from here. There is not a lot of info about this species or this kind of clumping growth pattern. Thanks to anyone able to help me out. I hope I didn’t butcher it too bad

 

[himmelich]

Maybe clump is the wrong term I mean a main trunk with the larger branches coming out at the same level, like fingers on a hand.

 

[gooeytek]

Does that bucket have drainage holes? You'll want a free-draining setup to avoid root rot.

 

[himmelich]

Does that bucket have drainage holes? You'll want a free-draining setup to avoid root rot.

Yes bottom is full of 1/4” drainage holes with mesh. Potted in ratio of about 1/2 part potting soil to 1/4 part perlite and 1/4 peat moss. Did I cut too much of the branches off?

 

[PonderingSage:]

I would recommend you look at Walter Pall’s blog to see some progressions of deciduous trees. Bonsai4me is a good one too. They are great tools in getting a sense of the work you need to do.
Good luck!

 

[Shibui]

It is quite difficult to give good advice with only a couple of 2D shots of a trunk to go on. Subtleties like how each trunk bends in relation to the others can be the difference between a mediocre tree and a good one.
Some basic guidelines for multi trunk trees:
1. Good multi trunk trees divide close to soil level.
2. Trunks that harmonize - similar bends are desirable.
3. Different trunk thickness and height is attractive and believable.
4. Even numbers of trunks (except 2) are much harder to arrange attractively than uneven numbers.
5. Good taper in trunks and branches is desirable as usual.

First up. Trees need to grow to produce food and energy to replace the lost roots after collection. We generally don't rush straight into styling immediately after transplant. Let the tree grow and recover this summer. Any styling and pruning can be next season.

The pictures show the trunks fork well above the main roots so not ideal for multi trunk style. There are choices - remove some of the trunks for an informal upright style tree. OR grow new roots closer to where the trunks fork.
I'm having a little trouble visualising the trunk lines and direction of all 4 trunks but the thicker one stands out because it appears to be much stronger and straighter than the others. Given that and that 3 trunks is usually better than 4 consider chopping the larger trunk if you still go for multi trunk.
It's not real clear how the 3 smaller trunks grow in relation to the lower trunk and roots but I suspect the angle will be hard to work with if the current trunk and roots are retained.
No real difference in thickness of those 3 trunks. Is it possible to retain the thicker trunk and 2 of the smaller ones? Need to examine trunk lines and direction to so if there's any harmony with thick and 2 others.

Second option is to look for a single trunk tree. Follow the curves from root level up to the trunks to find which trunk continues that flow best. Remove any that don't flow well. My guess is the thickest one looks awkward and also too thick compared to the lower trunk. I suspect I'd take it off first and see what that left me.
It looks like the remaining trunks are all quite long and skinny. I'd suggest some or all of the trunks will need to be reduced by at least half at some stage. This pruning and the subsequent new shoots will give bends, taper and branching in the future trunk.

By all means keep considering how to approach this tree but please let it recover before doing any more. Keep an open mind and be prepared to change tack if one or more of the trunks doesn't survive after transplant.

Good luck with the tree. I'm optimistic it will survive. There's plenty of roots (I would almost certainly have cut them much harder) and plenty of trunk to grow leaves.

 

[johng]

Please be aware that E. Redbud is an extremely tough tree to grow in a container. They appear not to like having their roots messed with at all. I didn't believe this and acquired 10 collected ones already in containers and appearing to be doing well...within 2-3 years all were dead...further inspection showed that not one of them had grown a single root since they had been collected. I certainly hope you do not have the same experience. I think the style you are referring to is broom style... thicker trunk terminating in 2-4 branches. I wouldn't worry about the styling at this point...do your best to keep it alive for a couple years and then consider your styling options.

 

[Tieball]

I believe your best strategy right now is to plant the tree and take care of it. Let the tree grow and gain healthy branches with leaves. I wouldn’t worry about styling the tree yet because it’s unknown which trunk sections will live and which will die, and unknown where and if branches will develop. That’s all I would do right now for several seasons….let it grow.

Eventually, assuming it lives after the collection and grows, you’ll need to chop off that lowest root extension right above your hand in the photo and prune back those long thick root extensions above your hand.

If it was my tree, I would have chopped the roots shorter immediately….all the way back to some finer roots growing. Those long stretched out roots will always be a problem. I can’t see what roots look like on the other side of the tree….if there are roots. However, right now, get the tree to grow.

I have Eastern Redbud trees all around me. They are an attractive nuisance. Branches regularly die off even on healthy in-ground trees.

 

[gooeytek]

Yes bottom is full of 1/4” drainage holes with mesh. Potted in ratio of about 1/2 part potting soil to 1/4 part perlite and 1/4 peat moss. Did I cut too much of the branches off?

It's a challenging tree to grow in a pot, as others have said. However, it's pretty tough when growing in the wild. At this point, if you left most of the roots alone like you showed in pic #2, I'm confident it'll recover. Just let it grow out and get healthy before doing any more styling. Most of the ones I've seen have multiple main branches like yours.

 

[Tieball]

I will be helpful if you add your general location and USDA growing zone to your profile.

 

[himmelich]

Thanks everyone for the encouragement and real talk! I am posting better photos of my little stump and for now just leaving it out to do its thing! I have read similar things about difficulty with eastern redbud roots, so my plan was to keep cutting from the bucket and possibly even replant in my front yard at some point. I am located in Western Pa. USDA 6b.

Should I be fertilizing yet or just wait until the plant recovers from shock? Thank you all for your help. Sorry for posting so many images I hope that is ok!

 

[himmelich]

It is quite difficult to give good advice with only a couple of 2D shots of a trunk to go on. Subtleties like how each trunk bends in relation to the others can be the difference between a mediocre tree and a good one.
Some basic guidelines for multi trunk trees:
1. Good multi trunk trees divide close to soil level.
2. Trunks that harmonize - similar bends are desirable.
3. Different trunk thickness and height is attractive and believable.
4. Even numbers of trunks (except 2) are much harder to arrange attractively than uneven numbers.
5. Good taper in trunks and branches is desirable as usual.

First up. Trees need to grow to produce food and energy to replace the lost roots after collection. We generally don't rush straight into styling immediately after transplant. Let the tree grow and recover this summer. Any styling and pruning can be next season.

The pictures show the trunks fork well above the main roots so not ideal for multi trunk style. There are choices - remove some of the trunks for an informal upright style tree. OR grow new roots closer to where the trunks fork.
I'm having a little trouble visualising the trunk lines and direction of all 4 trunks but the thicker one stands out because it appears to be much stronger and straighter than the others. Given that and that 3 trunks is usually better than 4 consider chopping the larger trunk if you still go for multi trunk.
It's not real clear how the 3 smaller trunks grow in relation to the lower trunk and roots but I suspect the angle will be hard to work with if the current trunk and roots are retained.
No real difference in thickness of those 3 trunks. Is it possible to retain the thicker trunk and 2 of the smaller ones? Need to examine trunk lines and direction to so if there's any harmony with thick and 2 others.

Second option is to look for a single trunk tree. Follow the curves from root level up to the trunks to find which trunk continues that flow best. Remove any that don't flow well. My guess is the thickest one looks awkward and also too thick compared to the lower trunk. I suspect I'd take it off first and see what that left me.
It looks like the remaining trunks are all quite long and skinny. I'd suggest some or all of the trunks will need to be reduced by at least half at some stage. This pruning and the subsequent new shoots will give bends, taper and branching in the future trunk.

By all means keep considering how to approach this tree but please let it recover before doing any more. Keep an open mind and be prepared to change tack if one or more of the trunks doesn't survive after transplant.

Good luck with the tree. I'm optimistic it will survive. There's plenty of roots (I would almost certainly have cut them much harder) and plenty of trunk to grow leaves.

This is super helpful thank you so much. I posted a few much better photos and what you are saying makes sense. For now I will just let the tree rest throughout the summer. Good to know not all hope is lost though and thank you for explaining!!

 

[himmelich]

I would recommend you look at Walter Pall’s blog to see some progressions of deciduous trees. Bonsai4me is a good one too. They are great tools in getting a sense of the work you need to do.
Good luck!

These are great resources thanks!

 

[Shibui]

The extra photos make it easier to pick up on the shapes and relative sizes.
Unfortunately I can't see any good spots where the multi trunks look in harmony. I think the best option would be to work with the low bends and trunk thickness and work towards a single trunk tree with a vague possibility of maybe a second strong trunk/branch from one of the smaller trunks.

No need to make any decisions yet and maybe no need to make decisions at all given the tree hasn't recovered from transplant yet.
All the best with recovery.