radhatter’s Yamadori Engelmann Spruce

radhatter

Sapling
Messages
45
Reaction score
39
Location
Seattle, Washington
USDA Zone
8b
Starting this thread to detail the journey of my yamadori engelmann spruce.

Collected originally in October of 2009 from somewhere along the White River in Washington State and came to me in exchange for money in May of 2024.
IMG_9569.jpeg

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This was it in the state that I received it. Growing fairly strong but certainly some leggy branching and multiple leaders. Hard to see in the center is that a lot of these branches originate from a single area just below the old broke apex of the tree. Concerned about inverse taper I decided before too long I would decide on a leader and thin this area out but I decided to take some time to admire and study the tree, as well as learn what I could about the species. Into a sunny space it went and it sat happily through spring, summer, and into fall.
IMG_0040.jpeg
I read that the best time to wire and work on engelmann spruce to minimize chance of die back is the fall, so as I felt that crisp in the air in mid October I got to work. I formulated a plan and decided on a front, a trunk line, and a dream. A single apex was chosen, the branches that didn’t fit into the vision were removed, and some light wiring was done. The branches are admittedly leggy but there are back buds all over the place so the plan for the next few years will be to fertilize and keep it happy as I prune back further and further to get the foliage closer to the trunk.

IMG_0477.jpeg
Here is the tree today, post repotting. March has come and temperatures are raising. The buds are swelling and I’ve spotted the bits of green as the first one or two buds begin to open. I decided now is the time to get it into a new pot. I chose a larger pot that it may eventually live in but I want to give it some room to spread its roots and recover from the repotting. As far as I can tell it’s been in that black pot for many many years, possibly since collection. It was absolutely full of roots and circling quite a bit but there were a lot of fibrous roots as well. This year’s plan is to let it recover and fill out again. I may do some light pinching to encourage more back budding. Engelmann spruce has a tendency to only send out one bud at the end of new growth as opposed to some other spruces which will have buds all along new growth that you can cut back to.
While the needles can be sharp, the tree has a lovely blue cast to its foliage and this particular tree has such wonderful movement, it’s a real privilege to have it in my garden.
Thanks for reading and if you’ve got experience with this species or any other tidbits of advice, please feel free to leave a note!
 
Starting this thread to detail the journey of my yamadori engelmann spruce.

Collected originally in October of 2009 from somewhere along the White River in Washington State and came to me in exchange for money in May of 2024.
View attachment 588891

View attachment 588894

This was it in the state that I received it. Growing fairly strong but certainly some leggy branching and multiple leaders. Hard to see in the center is that a lot of these branches originate from a single area just below the old broke apex of the tree. Concerned about inverse taper I decided before too long I would decide on a leader and thin this area out but I decided to take some time to admire and study the tree, as well as learn what I could about the species. Into a sunny space it went and it sat happily through spring, summer, and into fall.
View attachment 588892
I read that the best time to wire and work on engelmann spruce to minimize chance of die back is the fall, so as I felt that crisp in the air in mid October I got to work. I formulated a plan and decided on a front, a trunk line, and a dream. A single apex was chosen, the branches that didn’t fit into the vision were removed, and some light wiring was done. The branches are admittedly leggy but there are back buds all over the place so the plan for the next few years will be to fertilize and keep it happy as I prune back further and further to get the foliage closer to the trunk.

View attachment 588893
Here is the tree today, post repotting. March has come and temperatures are raising. The buds are swelling and I’ve spotted the bits of green as the first one or two buds begin to open. I decided now is the time to get it into a new pot. I chose a larger pot that it may eventually live in but I want to give it some room to spread its roots and recover from the repotting. As far as I can tell it’s been in that black pot for many many years, possibly since collection. It was absolutely full of roots and circling quite a bit but there were a lot of fibrous roots as well. This year’s plan is to let it recover and fill out again. I may do some light pinching to encourage more back budding. Engelmann spruce has a tendency to only send out one bud at the end of new growth as opposed to some other spruces which will have buds all along new growth that you can cut back to.
While the needles can be sharp, the tree has a lovely blue cast to its foliage and this particular tree has such wonderful movement, it’s a real privilege to have it in my garden.
Thanks for reading and if you’ve got experience with this species or any other tidbits of advice, please feel free to leave a note!
Great start, consider adding some movement to the right in the apex. Will add some dynamic to the design and complement the initial movement in the trunk line. Nice change to the planting angle and exposure of nebari. Work into you plan how you will compensate with pruning to balance branch thickness particularly in the mid section with the two thicker branches. Just a couple of design thoughts.
 
Great start, consider adding some movement to the right in the apex. Will add some dynamic to the design and complement the initial movement in the trunk line. Nice change to the planting angle and exposure of nebari. Work into you plan how you will compensate with pruning to balance branch thickness particularly in the mid section with the two thicker branches. Just a couple of design thoughts.
Good feedback, I’ll look into how the apex can potentially move to the right. I should take some pictures from the right and left sides as well as it’ll add some context that’s lost to the 2d picture.
I’d also like to move the branch to the left down a bit to follow and mirror the trunk line.

Your comment regarding the 2 larger branches, are you suggesting pruning those 2 and working to increase the thickness of the branch below it?
 
I’ll look into how the apex can potentially move to the right
If the top of the trunk is wired it could be positioned that way now! This creates unity with the base direction.
I’d also like to move the branch to the left down a bit to follow and mirror the trunk line.
That branch could come down and lengthen to counterbalance the flow of the trunk to the right. Not sure I would try to mimic trunk movement in that location. Consider this branch a key branch creating balance.
Your comment regarding the 2 larger branches, are you suggesting pruning those 2 and working to increase the thickness of the branch below it?
Yes, slow down and compact the two thicker branches, allow the lower right branch to thicken before shortening and compacting over time. This would balance the branch thickness appropriate for position on the trunk.

I drew a couple of lines on your photo to suggest the ideas expressed for your consideration. Change of apical direction, improve primary branch thickness for positioning and counterbalance the slant. Keeps the design with some dynamic and also improves overall proportion. The majority of the unity will come from the branch positioning, adjusting branch length and refining pad shapes over time. Just rough ideas to consider.
 

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I have collected a lot of Englemann spruce from Oregon. Highly recommend you fertilize with Miracle Gro to get back buddings on the lower branches when you cut them back.
 
I have collected a lot of Englemann spruce from Oregon. Highly recommend you fertilize with Miracle Gro to get back buddings on the lower branches when you cut
Thanks for the recommendation! I’ll give that a shot as it’s part of my regular feedings. I’m trying out osmocote this year as well. Any concerns on using both?
 
If the top of the trunk is wired it could be positioned that way now! This creates unity with the base direction.

That branch could come down and lengthen to counterbalance the flow of the trunk to the right. Not sure I would try to mimic trunk movement in that location. Consider this branch a key branch creating balance.

Yes, slow down and compact the two thicker branches, allow the lower right branch to thicken before shortening and compacting over time. This would balance the branch thickness appropriate for position on the trunk.

I drew a couple of lines on your photo to suggest the ideas expressed for your consideration. Change of apical direction, improve primary branch thickness for positioning and counterbalance the slant. Keeps the design with some dynamic and also improves overall proportion. The majority of the unity will come from the branch positioning, adjusting branch length and refining pad shapes over time. Just rough ideas to consider.
Love the suggestion on the apex, I’ve already made that adjustment! Your branch suggestions are pretty much in line with what I had in mind in the future as well. Hopefully I get some strong back budding this year so I can start to push these branches back and compact
 
Love the suggestion on the apex, I’ve already made that adjustment! Your branch suggestions are pretty much in line with what I had in mind in the future as well. Hopefully I get some strong back budding this year so I can start to push these branches back and compact
You have a great resource locally in the books authored by David DeGroot. He illustrates some great design ideas in his writing on the topic "Principles of Bonsai Design" Highly recommend those interested check out his publications.
helps to remind Bonsai enthusiasts how to artistically improve design of bonsai. By considering proportion, balance and unity within the expectations of common Bonsai Styles.
If you get the chance, attend one of his workshops or obtain one of his books.
Basic Bonsai Design. 1995
Principles of Bonsai Design First Edition 2015
Principles of Bonsai Design Second Edition 2022
 
Thanks for the recommendation! I’ll give that a shot as it’s part of my regular feedings. I’m trying out osmocote this year as well. Any concerns on using both?
Osmocote is slow releasing and I use 2 big scoops per gallon of Miracle Gro, eventhough they recommend 1 scoop per gallon and I applied once a week. I'm getting a lot of back buddings with great result. The dosage is strong in liquid form, but you're not really over fertilize because you're watering everyday during the growing season and it get diluted.
 
You have a great resource locally in the books authored by David DeGroot. He illustrates some great design ideas in his writing on the topic "Principles of Bonsai Design" Highly recommend those interested check out his publications.
helps to remind Bonsai enthusiasts how to artistically improve design of bonsai. By considering proportion, balance and unity within the expectations of common Bonsai Styles.
If you get the chance, attend one of his workshops or obtain one of his books.
Basic Bonsai Design. 1995
Principles of Bonsai Design First Edition 2015
Principles of Bonsai Design Second Edition 2022
David is in my bonsai association! I’ll probably see him in a few days and I’ll see if I can get my hands on his book
 
David is in my bonsai association! I’ll probably see him in a few days and I’ll see if I can get my hands on his book
You are very fortunate, some of his sketches explaining design principles are almost an exact replica of the tree form you are working on. Great opportunity for you. He is very approachable.
 
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