Pin Oak Cuttings - A Tutorial in the Making

[Johnathan]

So after deciding I couldn't collect this tree, due to the 12 inch trunk, no flare, and barbed wire running through it.





I decided to get dome cuttings. Came home to research only to find that nobody anywhere in the history of the world has documented oak cuttings, or how they did them, or if it worked long term.

I decided I'd give it a shot..... so here we are!! Please give advice, suggestions, ideas, critiques, anything you want! I honestly have no idea if I did this right or if it will even work lol

I decided to go with cuttings of various sizes and age. Mostly this year and last year's growth. Here are the cuttings :



I watched a few videos of cuttings where some people said to just toss then into a pot and they will root, this seemed a little to good to be true, I figured if that worked we would have more videos of Oak tree cuttings. I came across a video where a guy was using a plastic tub and cups. I figured this sounds good considering humidity necessary and ability to see the roots forming without disturbing them, so I went that route:



I watched the propagation of another species and they suggested soaking the cuttings in rooting hormone and water, so that's where I started. I figured this would need as much cheating and help possible lol



Since this is an experiment I decided why not get really crazy, and even decided to try some future twin trunks lol perks of being a newbie is you can try anything without feeling guilty:



I had been gone all day on an unsuccessful collecting trip, my daughter left this morning to spend the week visiting my mother in Arlington. Once she realized I had snuck back into the garage the wife was suddenly hungry, and c'mon cant say no to Mexican right? Hurried up and just got everything in there. Planning to let them soak for 30 minutes.

 

[Johnathan]

Sooooooo about 2 hours later after being dragged to Target, I was finally back home to resume. I needed drainage but not to much so I decided to go with thumbtack size holes. 9 of them actually. 5 and the bottom and 4 around the sides of the cups. I figured it would help with air flow:





I chose potting mix and perlite as the soil, it's about a 4 to 1 ratio in favor of potting mix. I was going to use some red bud compost, but unfortunately I was all out.



After putting the mix into the cups, I filled the cups up and this is where I made my first questionable move in my eyes. I filled the cups with water BEFORE putting the cuttings into them.



Here is the 2nd mystery of the night for me..... HOW to cut them. Some of the info I had came across suggested cutting into a "V" and some other sites suggested only placing slits into the cuttings. I just figured I'd do both. First, I did 5 in the V cuts.



Of course I dipped them back into the rooting hormone water mix, and then recoated with straight hormone



Sooooooo here is where I realized I probably shouldn't have wet the cups before planting them. They hadn't completely drained out!!!! I used a wooden skewer to try and make a hole for the cutting, and realized it was still a soupy mix! I also needed a way to remember how they were cut so, simple enough I marked the cups "C" for cut and "S" for slices:



Here is the Slicing technique that I used. I cut them again straight across after soaking them and then made about 3 slices into the bottom:



These were then all coated with rooting hormone and planted into the soupy mix lol

 

[Johnathan]

Soooo I also have a shimpaku forest in mind and after seeing an amazing forest from Walter Pall, I decided I'd toss a few shimpaku cuttings in there also:



All of the cuttings were then placed into the container and they were misted with a spray bottle and placed in an area where they will never get direct sunlight, but should get a decent amount of heat and ambient sunlight.



I had a few of these bigger cuttings left over. I am going to allow them to soak in the rooting hormone water until tomorrow, and then just plant them into my existing pots somewhere. I figured I might as well give the "just toss em in a pot" method a try anyway. I will remove most of the leaves before planting them tomorrow.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Good write up!
Oaks are notoriously hard to strike. I hope this works out for you.

 

[Johnathan]

Good write up!
Oaks are notoriously hard to strike. I hope this works out for you.

Exactly, and thank you!! Some people have claimed to have success. I'm just trying to see how they did it lol

 

[Johnathan]

So I finally got around to putting a couple into pots with other established trees. Both other forms of oaks lol.

The first is in a sand/ clay mix from a live oak I recently obtained. The plans are to start an airlayer on that live oak next spring, so it'll hang out there until next spring. It was recently watered so it looks like a pool lol, you can see the tub of cuttings in the background.



The other was placed into NAPA DE, as I'm writing this I'm actually thinking this will die really soon. When I planted it I didnt think about my miracle gro fertilizer.

This post oak has started getting weekly feedings of the blue juice. So I doubt the roots will form in that environment. Oh well. We will find out.



Lastly, I know Oaks are hard to root, but I was just wondering if that's because we as humans make it hard. I decided to leave a few cuttings in a cup of rooting hormone water and see what happens. They are in my garage, the garage usually gets opened daily so they will probably get a lot of direct sun from about 3 or 4pm to sundown on most days until late fall/ early winter.



I will continue to mist everything whenever I water trees, which is usually daily.

See you guys in a few weeks with an update!

 

[Johnathan]

Just an update.... a fatal update lol I didn't factor in drainage of my "greenhouse " I allowed the cuttings to sit in the container with water inside of it. I was thinking, it would get hot enough that standing water would assist with humidity, and ultimately just evaporate.

I was wrong lol after I noticed some black fuzzies on a few of the cuttings I decided to drill holes for drainage.

Unfortunately it was too late. In this picture you can kinda see what I think is the pest that led to the demise. not sure what it is, but you can also see the leaves starting to blacken.



I sprayed with Miracle Gro Organic Insecticide Soap or maybe it was the 3 in 1, I'm not honestly sure I remember. This was a few weeks ago.

Sadly conditions kept on deteriorating and I moved the storage bin to the garage for trash day.

Well, I had been busy so they set in the garage for a week or so before I finally got around to throwing them away. Here is what they looked like.







I'm pretty sure they stayed far wet for way too long. Will try again in spring.

 

[Johnnyd]

Sorry things did not go as planned. I have also admired the Pin Oak . I wonder if they would air layer. You could start off with an area that has taper. I would wait until spring though. Just a thought. Good luck!

 

[Anthony]

Does your oak mother have surface roots and can you try grafting a
cutting onto a small root ?
Encourage, encourage
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Johnathan]

Does your oak mother have surface roots and can you try grafting a
cutting onto a small root ?
Encourage, encourage
Good Day
Anthony

Sorry things did not go as planned. I have also admired the Pin Oak . I wonder if they would air layer. You could start off with an area that has taper. I would wait until spring though. Just a thought. Good luck!

No it's not my mother oak. Its a tree that was in a construction zone. The workers allowed me to cut a few off. I'm not sure if they intend to bulldoze the tree or not, but if they don't I will get more in spring.

 

[Dav4]

I can't speak for the oak, but the best time to strike shimpaku junipers is late winter... in OK, I'd shoot for sometime in February.

 

[Anthony]

Is it that you have no space to ground grow ?

Just checked Amazon for Pin Oak seedlings.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

My experience with juniper cuttings in zone 5 is that it will take about 18 months to form roots, but the cuttings will persist, and then root and grow. So don't despair if you don't see roots on the junipers in only 6 weeks. Yes, winter cuttings are recommended, but I have had success with summer cuttings too, not 100%, but over 25%.

Oak cuttings, I tried a few times with no success. Your experience is not too different than mine.

M. Dir in his 1987 edition "Reference Manuel of Woody Plant Propagation from Seed to Tissue Culture", says the entire genus of Quercus has a reputation of being impossible to reproduce by cuttings in a commercial quantity. He goes on to state a researcher in Texas had success rooting cuttings of Quercus virginiana in May, August and the warm early days of October. Cuttings taken in cooler weather November to April failed to root. Cuttings from young trees, less than 8 years old, rooted more easily than cuttings from mature trees. Cuttings from mature trees were near 100% failure. 10,000 ppm K-IBA solution was used. Semi-hardwood cuttings were used, pencil thin or thinner. Well drained perlite & peat media, bottom heat. A polytent was not satisfactory. Cuttings were held under mist for 12 weeks then hardened off under reduced mist. Juvenility of the cuttings was essential. Cuttings taken from previously rooted cuttings achieved highest success at 81% (my note: implying the original batch had significantly less than 81% success). Dirr suggests that this approach might be extended to species beyond just Q. virginiana.

So from the books, the closed container was probably a bad idea. Bottom heat would have helped. And there was a specific concentration and component for the rooting hormone.

All in all not surprising you had no success, but also pointing out that it has been done and documented by at least one dude on one species.

The book goes on to discuss seed propagation of oaks, and grafting to propagate oaks. Grafting has a few tricks and suggestions, not a highly successful method for reproducing oaks, but much more successful than cuttings.

Take it from there. I have not seen anything since this 1987 publication to suggest anyone has worked out a system for rooting cuttings that was easier, or had a higher success rate.

 

[sparklemotion]

18 months!? That definitely changes my perspective on how much I suck at striking juniper cuttings.

@Johnathan, I'm sorry that your oak cuttings didn't turn out but I really appreciate the time that you took to document and share your process.

 

[Johnathan]

@Dav4 thank you for that info. I was attempting to root these so that I can add them to my other 5 shimp growouts. I have no idea what to do with them lol I was just thinking keep on getting cuttings and make a forest, but now I'll probably just twist the other 5 I have and forget about them for 10 years lol

@Leo in N E Illinois as always, another solid informative post. Thank you for taking the time to reply. Based on the info you supplied, I'm not saying that I won't ever try cuttings again, but now I'm leaning more towards @Anthony suggestion. Not only are cuttings pretty stiff to begin with, so the movement wouldn't be there, but I suppose a smaller already established seedling still limber enough to bend would be more ideal to our mission in bonsai

@sparklemotion and @Johnnyd thanks for the kind words. No such thing as failure, just always learning!

 

[Pitoon]

Try air layering next time.

 

[Shinjuku]

Thank you for having the guts to post your “failure.” We all have a tendency to show off our successes and quietly never post pictures when things go wrong. Other people can learn just as much from “fails” as successes, so thanks for spreading more knowledge.

 

[BonsaiNaga13]

I've seen pin oaks fused in nature. Admire the trees but never seen one successful as a bonsai. I'm considering trying a pin oak fusion

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Try air layering next time.

Not to be a ''Debbie Downer'' or a ''Negative Nellie'', but as a general rule, if a tree is considered difficult to root from cuttings, it is very likely to be equally difficult to air layer. The mechanisms required to produce new roots on a layer are the same to get a cutting to produce new roots. My comment is not an absolute, but if I were a betting man, I would bet the oaks are equally difficult to air layer.

Though it might be worth a try. If it worked only one in 10 tries, that is still better than nothing. Note comments about younger than 8 year old cuttings were the only ones to have any success. If I were to try an air layer, it would be young wood.

 

[Beerboy]

I collected some pin oak seeds in May (Southern Hemisphere so my Fall/Winter), stratified them in the fridge over winter and planted 2-3 months ago. All 8 or so sprouted about a month ago and are growing strongly. They seem very easy from seed.