My freebee tamarind

c54fun

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I ordered a small Brazilian raintree but was sent this little tamarind. He said to just keep it and sent me the brt. I just let it grow for a while and it went crazy. Kept getting more and more leaves. I decided to trim it down and bend the trunk to at least give it some movement. Still not sure on what I will do next. Let it grow and thicken up for now.
Its bent pretty good right now and is starting to grow again.
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Anthony

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Oh no, tamarinds don't need wires, they grow very fast and respond well to grow and clip.

Also they don't feature surface roots, save through extreme soil erosion.

Be careful, you could end up with a Japanese wannabe thingee.

Additionally, the leaves when rotted keep the tree in acid soil. The tamarind fruit is a 4 on the acid/alkaline scale.

Pity, the first image was a good start, to build the root mass, and then next year a simple repot of either up potting
into a larger pot and say 1" all round in fresh soil mix.

The next stage of maturity is flaking bark, starts at the base of the trunk.

Hope it survives. Best of growing luck,
Good Day'
Anthony
 

Cypress187

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Interesting wire technique, but wasn't the clamp enough?
 

c54fun

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Wire helps hold it in place and I can move the clamp around. Just the clamp would have to stay in place for longer to set the bend. I have it over bent right now. After the clamp is off maybe 20% less bend then I'm going to move the clamp up another inch and add a little more bend to make it smoother.
 

c54fun

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Just moved the clamp up. This is about what I'm looking for in the trunk. The next couple of weeks I will over bend it a little more then take the clamp off. Already putting out good growth since the trim.
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New growth. Wont be long and it will be full again.
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c54fun

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Smaller picture. Hard to see in the pictures what I see here. If I stand back some the tree now has a nice s curve started. Thats all I really wanted for now.
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The trick with compound trees is to keep working the foliage throughout the year like ficus.
Every other month I reduce all foliage back to the first pair of leaves on each shoot.
 

Anthony

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Stacy,

hmm, the problem with cutting back a Tamarind continuously, is it has to be fed fertliser weekly.
Which can be done down here until say September,
BUT it can be affected by water on the leaves over night and anyone excavating nearby, the young leaves get a white powder.
You can read about the problem on the Internet with articles from India.

Additionally, tamarinds are very top dominant and will keep on trying to re-straighten their trunks.

The curved ones seen on-line from the East are large young trees, that have been chopped for firewood.

So if you look carefully, you can see the often unhealed wounds.

They can pack on 3 inches a year on the trunk, when they have enough open space.
So you can produce a 15" tall specimen, 3" trunk with 6 branches in one year and 2 to 4 more for branchlets.
BUT the mature trunk will normally still take 8 to 10 years, which is flaking bark.
Apologies if this repeated information, as I know Miami has Tamarinds.
Good Day
Anthony
 
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Sorry reading back over this post, wanted to clarify a few things... First not sure where you live on phone now, so foes not tell me...

You need to pay attention to weather and health of the tree...

When first starting a tree from basically nothing.... I cut back to the first set of growth on a branch. Then let it grow... a month later,or sooner if it is taking off, I cut back again. I do this for the first year... at the end of the year you usually end up with tons of fine branching. I then pick the bottom one's that I want to grow out, and wire them into place and stop cutting on these... I continue to cut everything above. This forces energy lower. When these begin to get close to the size I want and where I need them, I begin to cut back again on them. And move up to the next region I want to grow out... as well I continue to cut above. Energy is now sent to this region. And continue up.

After some years of doing this... The top will end up wirh emense amount of ramification and the bottom will have less... so then you will need to go through and begin to eliminate some of this, to send the energy back down to allow for more ramification at the bottom... to equal our the tree.

So, for the moment my game plan for your tree would be to just try and concentrate on establishing as many branches as possible coming off of the trunk... every thing else is sacrificed in the process of trying to do this. Once this has been obtained, every thing else is sacrificed for establishing bottom branches. and so on...

Think long term and do not get hung up on a image that looks cool now, and in 5-6 years you will begin to have even wirh this tree a very amazing show worthy tree.

This plan is pretty much fool proof.
 
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c54fun

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The trick with compound trees is to keep working the foliage throughout the year like ficus.
Every other month I reduce all foliage back to the first pair of leaves on each shoot.
Never had a ficus. What does this do reducing foliage just leaving the first pair on each shoot?
Edit. Wrote this before seeing your last replay.
 
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Stacy,

hmm, the problem with cutting back a Tamarind continuously, is it has to be fed fertliser weekly.
Which can be done down here until say September,
BUT it can be affected by water on the leaves over night and anyone excavating nearby, the young leaves get a white powder.
You can read about the problem on the Internet with articles from India.

Additionally, tamarinds are very top dominant and will keep on trying to re-straighten their trunks.

The curved ones seen on-line from the East are large young trees, that have been chopped for firewood.

So if you look carefully, you can see the often unhealed wounds.

They can pack on 3 inches a year on the trunk, when they have enough open space.
So you can produce a 15" tall specimen, 3" trunk with 6 branches in one year and 2 to 4 more for branchlets.
BUT the mature trunk will normally still take 8 to 10 years, which is flaking bark.
Apologies if this repeated information, as I know Miami has Tamarinds.
Good Day
Anthony
Without getting into a fertilizer debate...

Plants food is produced through photosynthesis... fertilizer is not food. It is for the most part a supliment. A bonsai can for the most part go through it's whole life without actually being fertilized.... this is as long as it is in a soil that has organics in it. In fact I have many a tree that I pretty much never fertilize... and they do fine. Now, fertilizer does speed up the process. However, there are times when you actually want to slow the growth of the tree down to produce very small internodes spacing... when I am trying to accomplish this, I never fertilize. Doing so, would speed up growth to much.

With the process of have laid out, what will be the determining factor will be it's response time... how long after being cut, does it need to be cut again...
The tree will tell you if it is slowing down, and if it is not because it is going into a dormant period like winter, it is because it is being over worked.
 
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Never had a ficus. What does this do reducing foliage just leaving the first pair on each shoot?
Edit. Wrote this before seeing your last replay.
Ficus are sometimes a bit trickier to get the ball rolling...

I say this because often most people get one from a big box store and it's condition is kinda not so good... So, if you have a focus that has very little branches and almost no foliage... in this case u will need to just let it grow wild for a couple if years to gain strength, to gain movement... this strength will be determined by branching growing very long in a fast amount of time. However it still may have very few leaves... Ficus do not put out tons of leaves unless they are continually worked.

With starting to establish a ficus the process of getting them up in running is a tad slower and my treatment if them is slower as well... I let them go as I have said for a couple of years or more if needed... then I cut everything back to a couple if inches away from the trunk... let all new growth grow for a couple of months, or more until I see a vast change in the amount of growth. Once I see this, I cut back to first couple of leaves... again I wait to see some movement, but this time I don't wait as long, I cut back again...
And I continue...

The thought here is that each time you cut, the spacing between when you do it should get less and less... what will determine thus will be the tree's response... it should get quicker, and there should be each time more and more branches and foilage to remove.

After a while of doing this, I then switch to a process of once a month or more, cutting back only on longer shoots, and instead switch to just removing the terminal bud on the end of each shoot. As well I begin to wire finer branching down flat... this opens up the area and helps new growth to form further back.

At some point you will end up with a mass amount of finer branching, and your tree will look like a topiary... so you will need to decide what to let grow long and what to keep short. Again, start at the lowest areas, and establish these first, continue to cut everything above. And slowly work you way up the tree.

When starting off a tree, you are first trying to establish lots of branching coming from the trunk, once this is set you move on.

Do not defoliate a ficus!
This is a silly process, that is out dated...
The only time I ever do this nowadays is on a tree that has white Flys or bugs, because it seems to be the easiest way to once and for all get rid of them, and spray.

There is no need to defoliate... all problems can be solved by wiring a branch down, this will automatically produce growth further in to which to cut back to.
And leaf size is determined by the amount of leaves, which can easily be accomplished just by routinely cutting and removing terminal buds... defoliating only produces finer leaves until they grow out.
 
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Anthony

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Interesting Stacy, the wiring down bit. Thanks will give it a try.
Not so sure about the no fertiliser and Tamarind bit.
But will give it a try.
Thanks again.
Good Day
Anthony
 

c54fun

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Sawgrass, thanks for the info. Very helpful.
 

Anthony

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Oh Stacy,

here is w whate do. Before defoliation we fertilise for at least a month. Remember our soil is at least 1/3 organic by
volume and it is aged compost, so it carries at least 5 N 3 P 2 K or so.

Defoliation is more for bud activation, especially on a tamarind or gmelina. Smaller leaves we get from full sun and the
tree growing back so /too many buds.

However with the tamarinds, we have to use bamboo skewers to knock off the extra buds and since this is done once for
the year around April / May. There are usually too many buds. Many changes in direction and great ramification.
Then we stop the growth as 1 top, 2 side, 3 base, as the pinnate leaves go. Usually after 3 at the top / side/base have developed

Additionally if we don't feed the 1/3 strength lawn fertiliser once a week into moist soil the leaves age badly and early, so
you don't get them lasting a whole year. Exposure is full sun.

Soil by the way is compost made mostly of tamarind leaves and flowers [ we have a good many trees on the island, high Hindu
population as Indians go.]
Keeps the soil acid and defoliated leaves are left on the soil to decay.
Just sharing.
Good Day
Anthony
 

c54fun

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Tamarinds got the big wire removed, clamp off and a trim. Ended up with a nice bend like I wanted in a short time. Will take some pictures tomorrow. Wont look like much but should be able to start to see the shape now.
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