Is Bonsai Mirai Live Worth $300/year?

Tier 2 since 2 months.
Very well worth it..only reason not to go Tier 3 is because the live Q&As happen at 1 and 4 am my time.
Ryan is talented, very well structured in his delivery and has a great flow of info he wants to address in each stream. Video and sound quality is great.
Sometimes he goes on tangents for few minutes but I personally enjoy it.
Site is well handled and the video library can be filtered by season, even early/mid or late season as well.as by material which makes it easier for me.as I filter for spring and have gone through early and mid spring videos already.
Can I come up with a critique or two in any video yes sure but then that's also true for university courses or business conventions or workshops. U just need to have a constructive way to criticise and then u don't end up hiding the value.
U can see some trees in multiple stages of development and styling which makes for a perfect exercise. I wish I could download the videos to watch in high res when I'm.in countries with poor connectivity or to watch on flight as watching pruning on low res is a pain , yet understand they need to protect the material and cant allow downloads.
U might save by subscribing for couple months every year and watching all previous videos.... but I personally believe in supporting people or institutions and payback for the value I gain which makes it sustainable for them.
 
MrWunderful said:
😂😂😂

My normal answer would be “nobody”. But yes I do know OF you, because I started reading your blog a few years ago.
Met you briefly I think at a show in 2015 but not sure.

Actually really like your style of deciduous tree, and might have learned something from you as well (on accident 😉)

That being said, I dont care for your posting style, although sometimes I agree with your points. You always come off as Cranky.

And I REALLY dont care if you think my trees are worthy/ not worthy because to me bonsai isnt about winning shows- although hopefully one day I will have something worthy of making it in. If not, oh well.

I stand by my point about Mirai, which was the purpose of this thread.
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Good because my career in bonsai has been an open book. Everyone knows who the hell I am. The difference is you stand behind a wall of anonymity. Your words carry weight in anonymity but maybe not so much when we have your identity. You don't want to share your name nor your trees. What the hell are you afraid of? Some shitty wife after you for cheating? Come out from behind the mask and tell us how you really feel.

I don't come here to be liked, never have, I just keep telling the truth......I have been known to change the purpose of a thread. what you do is a disservice to guys like Ryan. You talk him all up, but never show what you learn. Ryan went to Japan to learn, he has never been shy about showing us what he can do. Why are all the Ryan followers shy about posting trees. I thought that was the whole point of spending all the money in the first place....to get better and show people how great you have learned.

This quote says it all and I don't really need you to show me anything....I already know

"And I REALLY dont care if you think my trees are worthy/ not worthy because to me bonsai isnt about winning shows- although hopefully one day I will have something worthy of making it in. If not, oh well."

Thats a defeated person talking if I have ever heard one....My intention was not to make you face your demons...have a good night.
 
Smoke said:
Good because my career in bonsai has been an open book. Everyone knows who the hell I am. The difference is you stand behind a wall of anonymity. Your words carry weight in anonymity but maybe not so much when we have your identity. You don't want to share your name nor your trees. What the hell are you afraid of? Some shitty wife after you for cheating? Come out from behind the mask and tell us how you really feel.

I don't come here to be liked, never have, I just keep telling the truth......I have been known to change the purpose of a thread. what you do is a disservice to guys like Ryan. You talk him all up, but never show what you learn. Ryan went to Japan to learn, he has never been shy about showing us what he can do. Why are all the Ryan followers shy about posting trees. I thought that was the whole point of spending all the money in the first place....to get better and show people how great you have learned.

This quote says it all and I don't really need you to show me anything....I already know

"And I REALLY dont care if you think my trees are worthy/ not worthy because to me bonsai isnt about winning shows- although hopefully one day I will have something worthy of making it in. If not, oh well."

Thats a defeated person talking if I have ever heard one....My intention was not to make you face your demons...have a good night.
Click to expand...

Defeated? Lol. You are Cranky. Im nobody in the bonsai world, and never had anything to prove. You apparently do feel you do.

Being a dick isnt the same as telling the truth.

Im in it for the relaxation and enjoyment. For some reason, you just cannot accept that I dont mind paying 300 a year for mirai videos. Thats pretty immature. I tell people into bonsai to check out Mirai all the time, too.

Try and be less salty about other peoples success, its a bad look. Maybe not as bad as saying “Do you know who I am?” LOL
 
MrWunderful said:
Defeated? Lol. You are Cranky. Im nobody in the bonsai world, and never had anything to prove. You apparently do feel you do.

Being a dick isnt the same as telling the truth.

Im in it for the relaxation and enjoyment. For some reason, you just cannot accept that I dont mind paying 300 a year for mirai videos. Thats pretty immature. I tell people into bonsai to check out Mirai all the time, too.

Try and be less salty about other peoples success, its a bad look. Maybe not as bad as saying “Do you know who I am?” LOL
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Come on guys.... this isn’t what we are here for. I think we can agree the world is full of enough bad sh** right now, can we put this tiff to bed??? 1591318576663.jpeg
 
MrWunderful said:
Defeated? Lol. You are Cranky. Im nobody in the bonsai world, and never had anything to prove. You apparently do feel you do.

Being a dick isnt the same as telling the truth.

Im in it for the relaxation and enjoyment. For some reason, you just cannot accept that I dont mind paying 300 a year for mirai videos. Thats pretty immature. I tell people into bonsai to check out Mirai all the time, too.

Try and be less salty about other peoples success, its a bad look. Maybe not as bad as saying “Do you know who I am?” LOL
Click to expand...
My question was asked because you probably know who I am. I still don't know who you are. I'm not being a dick at all, just asking for some facts. If a person is willing to pay that kind of money, surly you must be getting something for your money. You say you do, but you feel you can't share it. I don't want to know what you learn, you paid for that, I want to see how you applied what you paid for to your trees. I don't think that is out of the ordinary request for someone that comes to a public forum and interacts with people here. We are all here to share, or is your reason to come here and be a taker? I am sure I am not alone in this quest to see what people learn. I know a lot of people in this state, and around the USA, believe me when I say that all those that I interact with that espouse the greatness of Ryan Neal, and I ask them what they have learned in the video's. You know what the answer is? Out of about 40 people ten of them in my club, they say "this and that"

This and that, is what they learned. This and that is what they paid 300.00 a year for. You know why they say this and that? because a video format is perfect for taking peoples money and not showing them anything. It is not really great for learning, @Adair M here goes to Boon. Why! He could just buy the video's. Boon has many video's for sale. Why would anyone need to go see Boon rather than just watching the video. Because video's are terrible for learning. They are great for basics and shit like that so the teacher doesn't have to waste his time telling everyone about all that shit every time they meet. "Go home and watch the video!"

I am willing to bet you don't want me to know who you are...do you?
 
Will anyone on this forum cough up a picture of what MIR has done for you in actual help in styling a tree? There is 23 pages of crapola here and not one before and after picture of an "ah ha" moment from a video.
 
Smoke said:
My question was asked because you probably know who I am. I still don't know who you are. I'm not being a dick at all, just asking for some facts. If a person is willing to pay that kind of money, surly you must be getting something for your money. You say you do, but you feel you can't share it. I don't want to know what you learn, you paid for that, I want to see how you applied what you paid for to your trees. I don't think that is out of the ordinary request for someone that comes to a public forum and interacts with people here. We are all here to share, or is your reason to come here and be a taker? I am sure I am not alone in this quest to see what people learn. I know a lot of people in this state, and around the USA, believe me when I say that all those that I interact with that espouse the greatness of Ryan Neal, and I ask them what they have learned in the video's. You know what the answer is? Out of about 40 people ten of them in my club, they say "this and that"

This and that, is what they learned. This and that is what they paid 300.00 a year for. You know why they say this and that? because a video format is perfect for taking peoples money and not showing them anything. It is not really great for learning, @Adair M here goes to Boon. Why! He could just buy the video's. Boon has many video's for sale. Why would anyone need to go see Boon rather than just watching the video. Because video's are terrible for learning. They are great for basics and shit like that so the teacher doesn't have to waste his time telling everyone about all that shit every time they meet. "Go home and watch the video!"

I am willing to bet you don't want me to know who you are...do you?
Click to expand...

Ill be the guy doing Bonsai and enjoying it at what ever leisurely pace I want. Probably still watching Mirai videos, and *gasp* enjoying them without having to prove my technical abilities to a guy on the internet!
 
MrWunderful said:
Ill be the guy doing Bonsai and enjoying it at what ever leisurely pace I want. Probably still watching Mirai videos, and *gasp* enjoying them without having to prove my technical abilities to a guy on the internet!
Click to expand...
Great, I just wanted to know how to plan for all your future posts here and word my responses accordingly.
 
Just gonna throw another thought out there, but what about the entertainment value? Do you not put a price on that? I feel I'm in a position a lot of people probably aren't where I have the money to afford to do things I like, when I like. I enjoy bonsai so I pay to go to shows, I pay for classes, I pay a membership fee for a club. I've watched nearly all of the mirai videos. I don't have any fir, thuja, hemlock, coastal redwoods, ginkgo, bald cypress or many other species that Ryan works on but I watch the videos anyway because I find them interesting and entertaining. Will I still be a subscriber in a year or 2? Maybe not but that doesn't mean it isn't worth the money now. I might not have the tree's to show exactly what I've learnt but I now know a lot more than I did before. There are 2 sides to any form like bonsai, there is the practical side and the theory side
 
Sn0W said:
I might not have the tree's to show exactly what I've learnt but I now know a lot more than I did before.
Click to expand...

You, did it now. Do you understand what I mean? Read your words. tell me what you know that you didn't know. Did you learn a secret that only Mirai followers know. Do you know what fig. 3 is now. I mean this is the mantra; "I know more that I knew before". If you do then you should be able to quantify that with an intelligent response to something you learned from Ryan that you didn't know before.

You guys keep throwing out these talking points but no one wants to talk about it. They just want to recede into their cocoon and hope it goes away.

Shoot me three things that you are sure I have never heard of before. Believe it or not I have watched all the free video's, the larger portion until I just can't watch it anymore. I have watched Ryan in the collection work here in Fresno for two years. I have watched two demo's at GSBF conventions of Ryan's work and believe me he says nothing earth shattering. I have seen Kimura live, Kunio Koyabshi live and Shinji Suzuki right here in Fresno with Walter Pall. Seen Peter Warren and Hagadorn in demo's live and still to this day I have never heard one piece of information that I was able to take home and apply to a tree.

Here is Hagadorn busy at work. These pics are from ten years ago before Ryan even came home.

DSC_01450143.JPG

Ryan busy at work, doing what he does beast...PR

DSC_01620008.JPG

DSC_01640160.JPG

And this is the best of all. Peter warren with his tree that just didn't turn out like he wanted. "Sorry folks that was the best I could do"

I would have been embarrassed too...

DSC_01670163.JPG

DSC_01700166.JPG

This is the tree in circle. It would have made a magnificent semi cascade. In stead he opted for a mediocre upright tree with shitty branches. With the foliage he started with he could have actually made a finished tree which is what the other artists did. This was just a lack of imagination and really not being in the mood once it started going south. Just my opinion.

DSC_01730169_LI.jpg
 
Smoke said:
My question was asked because you probably know who I am. I still don't know who you are. I'm not being a dick at all, just asking for some facts. If a person is willing to pay that kind of money, surly you must be getting something for your money. You say you do, but you feel you can't share it. I don't want to know what you learn, you paid for that, I want to see how you applied what you paid for to your trees. I don't think that is out of the ordinary request for someone that comes to a public forum and interacts with people here. We are all here to share, or is your reason to come here and be a taker? I am sure I am not alone in this quest to see what people learn. I know a lot of people in this state, and around the USA, believe me when I say that all those that I interact with that espouse the greatness of Ryan Neal, and I ask them what they have learned in the video's. You know what the answer is? Out of about 40 people ten of them in my club, they say "this and that"

This and that, is what they learned. This and that is what they paid 300.00 a year for. You know why they say this and that? because a video format is perfect for taking peoples money and not showing them anything. It is not really great for learning, @Adair M here goes to Boon. Why! He could just buy the video's. Boon has many video's for sale. Why would anyone need to go see Boon rather than just watching the video. Because video's are terrible for learning. They are great for basics and shit like that so the teacher doesn't have to waste his time telling everyone about all that shit every time they meet. "Go home and watch the video!"

I am willing to bet you don't want me to know who you are...do you?
Click to expand...
Smoke, I’ll make a comment since you mentioned my name. I don’t subscribe to the Mirai videos, but I will watch the occasional free one on YouTube. If the subject matter is of interest.

So, I recently acquired an Ezo Spruce. I have limited spruce experience, I have a Colorado Blue Spruce I’m messing with, but nothing like an Englemann. Anyway, the Ryan video was on Englemann spruce, and they are fairly similiar to Ezo, so I watched it. I learned how he cleans old foliage to prep for wiring. I also learned how when wiring, when you get out where the needles are, you don’t try to lay the wire on the stem, you make a loose cage of wire around the outside of the needles. I didn’t know that little trick prior to watching the video. So, I did pick up a couple “this and that’s”.

Before I started attending the Boon Intensives, I did purchase Boon’s JBP video DVDs. They are very good, as far as videos go, but there’s still nothing better than in person instruction where specific instructions and corrections can be made in real time. For those who don’t have the opportunity to work with Boon in person, I do recommend the videos as the next best option.

Smoke, you were spoiled by living in California and having easy access to the pioneers of American bonsai: Naka, Oki, Nagatoshi, et al. Those of usin the rest of the US have not been as fortunate. We don’t have 5 bonsai shops within a 25 minute drive like you. We have had to struggle to get any information or exposure to bonsai. When I started 60 years ago, it was difficult to even get books about bonsai. The videos available today are amazing!
 
Adair M said:
Smoke, I’ll make a comment since you mentioned my name. I don’t subscribe to the Mirai videos, but I will watch the occasional free one on YouTube. If the subject matter is of interest.

So, I recently acquired an Ezo Spruce. I have limited spruce experience, I have a Colorado Blue Spruce I’m messing with, but nothing like an Englemann. Anyway, the Ryan video was on Englemann spruce, and they are fairly similiar to Ezo, so I watched it. I learned how he cleans old foliage to prep for wiring. I also learned how when wiring, when you get out where the needles are, you don’t try to lay the wire on the stem, you make a loose cage of wire around the outside of the needles. I didn’t know that little trick prior to watching the video. So, I did pick up a couple “this and that’s”.

Before I started attending the Boon Intensives, I did purchase Boon’s JBP video DVDs. They are very good, as far as videos go, but there’s still nothing better than in person instruction where specific instructions and corrections can be made in real time. For those who don’t have the opportunity to work with Boon in person, I do recommend the videos as the next best option.

Smoke, you were spoiled by living in California and having easy access to the pioneers of American bonsai: Naka, Oki, Nagatoshi, et al. Those of usin the rest of the US have not been as fortunate. We don’t have 5 bonsai shops within a 25 minute drive like you. We have had to struggle to get any information or exposure to bonsai. When I started 60 years ago, it was difficult to even get books about bonsai. The videos available today are amazing!
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May I add that had I not recently obtained a spruce, I would not have watched the Mirai video. And, it was just luck it appeared in my YouTube feed. I didn’t go searching for it. And it was a relatively short video, on the order of 10 minutes or so.

I have applied the knowledge I obtained. I’ve cleaned out the old foliage on my Ezo. I have not yet tried the wiring technique as the new growth needs to harden off before it gets wired. I’ll do it in a couple months.
 
World is changing we used to buy a book now we buy a kindle. We spend time on youtube and some of us do pay for the premium youtube for few features. Some even make money out of uploading stupid videos.... and yes we are more and more into paying for apps on our phones, cable subscription, netflix? Do we benefit from that is a controversial question but it allows us to spend good time and look at things that are of interest. More and more our lives will shift to subscription models.
Watching youtube videos might be a beneficial thing but could also be counterproductive if u dont really know whose video you are watching and I have learned many flawed things that were pointed out here on BN.
The advantage of streams or videos like Boons or Ryan's is that u have an accountable and known person who has much more exposure and speaks from long experience. You also find a more structured layout set of videos to cover a set learning path.
Is there different schools of thoughts can some have a different approach or methodology? You bet yes as that's universal and even medical practice has different schools of though in different countries...
Going back to financials if goes back to whether one can afford it, and if one is in a "luxury" hobby he might afford 18 usd for couple times a year to check videos of interest or if one is more capable maybe go in a yearly subscription to spend quality time watching and learning and also to support people doing this. Going to workshops and classes is also a paid activity so some just prefer or only have the time to do it from the comfort of their homes at specific times of availability. So if the question is the learning value it's definitely there and much better than random non structured youtubes. Financial goes back to ones being able.tonafford or willingness to pay same like a netflix subscription where instead one can watch TV yet not have the luxury of watching the series he wants at the exact time he wants.
I'm far from showing a tree as if u saw any of my trees you'll be all pushing me to upgrade to tier 3 and subscribe to 10 more teachers to hopefully be able to pull a half decent tree in 20 years from now, this doesn't mean that I won't still make the effort to read and watch to hopefully get there.
I relate that to a commercial bonsai practitioner I met who isnt on any of those learning channels not even any forum, Instagram nor facebook. He has a crazy collection of trees hes growing since 35 years and every year styles then moves a few to bonsai bits and sells. Are his trees beautiful? Well most trees are or else we wouldn't be in this hobby. Are they beautiful considering bonsai "guidelines" heck NO. Do they make him and his customers proud? You bet they do. Is he willing to learn from mirai , BN,Boon for free? Highly unlikely is he willing to subscribe for 300 usd ? Definitely
It's all very personal choices and no one can convince or prove the others right or wrong and it's all about the perceived value and u have to try things and then objectively decide if they are worth ur money and time and if so you hit the renew subscription every month or year. I'm more into reeftanks where we dont really get paid streams or videos or channels but I see many monkeys around on youtube channels becoming influencers and cashing on stupid videos full of mistakes and bad info and believe it or not people also pay entrance fees to conventions to go and listen to presentations sometimes from those stupid monkeys VS authorities in the hobby who have a proven track record.
 
Adair M said:
May I add that had I not recently obtained a spruce, I would not have watched the Mirai video. And, it was just luck it appeared in my YouTube feed. I didn’t go searching for it. And it was a relatively short video, on the order of 10 minutes or so.

I have applied the knowledge I obtained. I’ve cleaned out the old foliage on my Ezo. I have not yet tried the wiring technique as the new growth needs to harden off before it gets wired. I’ll do it in a couple months.
Click to expand...
...and I have no doubt that you will show us how it worked out for you in pictures, like what a good bonsai forum is for, not just talk.....
 
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