Importing seeds from Japan or buying them at your local store

[Hasagawa]

Are Japanese black pine (Kuro Matsu) or Japanese white pine (Goyou Matsu) seeds easily available in your country?
If I export these seeds from Japan, I need a plant phytosanitary certificate (1,200 yen for transportation), shipping costs (510 yen for Europe, 830 yen for the US), and the cost of the seeds (probably around 500 yen for 10 seeds; Japanese white pine is especially expensive).
The total amount will be about 3,000 yen (15 dollers).
So, is it still cheaper to buy these seeds in your country?

 

[Paradox]

Both have export restrictions

Pinus thunbergii China - Common Bonsai,Conifer - Japanese Black Pine

Introducing the Pinus thunbergii - Japanese Black Pine - a stunning horticultural tree that can reach an impressive height of 120 ft! Known for its resistance to pollution and salt, this pine is a popular choice for coastal planting as it holds beach sand

sheffields.com

Pinus parviflora - Common Bonsai,Conifer - Five-needle Pine, Japanese Five Needle Pine, Japanese White Pine

The Pinus parviflora, also known as Japanese White Pine or Japanese Five Needle Pine, is a beloved coniferous tree for its conical crown, slow growth, and picturesque wide pyramid shape. Growing up to 25 meters tall and as broad as it is tall, it features

sheffields.com

Not currently available

 

[Hasagawa]

Both have export restrictions

Pinus thunbergii China - Common Bonsai,Conifer - Japanese Black Pine

Introducing the Pinus thunbergii - Japanese Black Pine - a stunning horticultural tree that can reach an impressive height of 120 ft! Known for its resistance to pollution and salt, this pine is a popular choice for coastal planting as it holds beach sand

sheffields.com

Pinus parviflora - Common Bonsai,Conifer - Five-needle Pine, Japanese Five Needle Pine, Japanese White Pine

The Pinus parviflora, also known as Japanese White Pine or Japanese Five Needle Pine, is a beloved coniferous tree for its conical crown, slow growth, and picturesque wide pyramid shape. Growing up to 25 meters tall and as broad as it is tall, it features

sheffields.com

Not currently available

Thank you for your reply.
I found that I was not needed for overseas bonsai lovers.
Rather, I would like to use that store when I buy foreign pine seeds.

 

[Glaucus]

I assume you are in Japan offering to collect and sell seeds?

It may be that professional nurseries, or maybe really enthusiastic amateurs, that grow a lot of pines would be interested in if you collect pine seeds from the wild with specific genetics. Not pine expert, but maybe collecting seeds from pines that are especially old but beautiful, but also in either more hotter or colder locations, would be of interest to a few select people?
Probably, the value added would be to know exactly where the seeds came from, in the wild.

I believe in generally just rando black and white pine seeds would be somewhat easily available online.

 

[Paradox]

Yea I guess I misunderstood the first post

 

[Hasagawa]

I assume you are in Japan offering to collect and sell seeds?

It may be that professional nurseries, or maybe really enthusiastic amateurs, that grow a lot of pines would be interested in if you collect pine seeds from the wild with specific genetics. Not pine expert, but maybe collecting seeds from pines that are especially old but beautiful, but also in either more hotter or colder locations, would be of interest to a few select people?
Probably, the value added would be to know exactly where the seeds came from, in the wild.

I believe in generally just rando black and white pine seeds would be somewhat easily available online.

In Japan, the seeds used for pine bonsai come from specific regions.
Black pine seeds are Mikawa in Shizuoka Prefecture and White pine seeds are Mt. Ishizuchi in Aichi Prefecture.
Same as in fishing, the period during which can be harvested is regulated by law.

Unfortunately, Japanese companies are not willing to ship them overseas.
Troublesome procedures related to shipping, especially issuing certificates.
International bonsai lovers will probably be turned down or asked to pay a high fee.

So, as a non-profit, I thought I could help them in Actual costs incurred.
The quarantine station is 50 kilometers away, but if the number of shipping destinations increases, gasoline costs will be cheaper.
But if International bonsai lovers don't have any such desires, then this idea ends here.

Thank you so much.

 

[Hasagawa]

Yea I guess I misunderstood the first post

I apologize for the inconvenience.

 

[WNC Bonsai]

I apologize for the inconvenience.

In Japan, the seeds used for pine bonsai come from specific regions.
Black pine seeds are Mikawa in Shizuoka Prefecture and White pine seeds are Mt. Ishizuchi in Aichi Prefecture.
Same as in fishing, the period during which can be harvested is regulated by law.

Unfortunately, Japanese companies are not willing to ship them overseas.
Troublesome procedures related to shipping, especially issuing certificates.
International bonsai lovers will probably be turned down or asked to pay a high fee.

So, as a non-profit, I thought I could help them in Actual costs incurred.
The quarantine station is 50 kilometers away, but if the number of shipping destinations increases, gasoline costs will be cheaper.
But if International bonsai lovers don't have any such desires, then this idea ends here.

Thank you so much.

I don’t think it is a lack of interest so much as the fact that companies like Sheffield are already a good seed source most of the time plus there are vendors on eBay that sell seeds. They may not all come from the specific areas you mention in Japan and some may even come from China or Korea or even from trees in this country. For example Sheffield’s black pine seeds come from China and their Acer shirasawanum a collected from trees in Oregon state.

 

[Paradox]

I apologize for the inconvenience.

It was an misunderstanding on my part, not an inconvenience.
I thought you were trying to buy seeds, not sell them.
I dont buy seeds as I dont grow from seed. I dont have that kind of time left in my life, to grow a tree from seed.
However if I did, I would probably go with a reputable seller that already has seeds in the U.S. like the one I linked rather than a random unknown person from outside the country considering the import regulations and red tape that has to be followed to import legally. If something isnt followed correctly and the USDA finds out, they can come and destroy my entire collection of trees to fix whatever problem they perceive. Its just not worth the risk

 

[Kievnstavick]

I agree with paradoxes statement of having a hard time trusting an unknown source.

It would be a better bet to contact seed distributors like sheffields.com or other reputable dealers to see if they would be willing to buy seeds from you from Japan. They would have the resources and knowledge available to help make sure your seeds are acceptable past US customs.

The risks involved in breaking import laws are too great. Not only would I be risking my trees, but my garden, the surrounding natural environment, and being monetary responsible for all the damage involved with no legal standing to defend myself. It just isn't worth it.

Now, I don't want to dissuade you as acquiring certain seed species from Japan would definitely be appreciated by some of us. If I recall correctly, we can't aquire Japanese beech seeds in the States due to no one taking the time collect the seeds and go through the legal hoops (both Japanese and American). Do keep in mind that your target audience is already a niche part of a niche hobby in the States.

 

[Hasagawa]

関心が薄いというよりは、シェフィールドのような会社がすでにほとんどの場合に良い種子の供給元であり、種子を販売している eBay の業者がいるという事実だと思います。種子はすべてあなたが言及した日本の特定の地域から来ているわけではなく、中国や韓国から来ているものや、この国の木から来ているものもあるかもしれません。たとえば、シェフィールドの黒松の種子は中国から来ており、シラサワラモミジはオレゴン州の木から採取されています。

 

[Hasagawa]

I don’t think it is a lack of interest so much as the fact that companies like Sheffield are already a good seed source most of the time plus there are vendors on eBay that sell seeds. They may not all come from the specific areas you mention in Japan and some may even come from China or Korea or even from trees in this country. For example Sheffield’s black pine seeds come from China and their Acer shirasawanum a collected from trees in Oregon state.

It would be best if overseas bonsai artists could buy seeds and seedlings cheaply domestically.
That's best. Thanks.

 

[Hasagawa]

I agree with paradoxes statement of having a hard time trusting an unknown source.

It would be a better bet to contact seed distributors like sheffields.com or other reputable dealers to see if they would be willing to buy seeds from you from Japan. They would have the resources and knowledge available to help make sure your seeds are acceptable past US customs.

The risks involved in breaking import laws are too great. Not only would I be risking my trees, but my garden, the surrounding natural environment, and being monetary responsible for all the damage involved with no legal standing to defend myself. It just isn't worth it.

Now, I don't want to dissuade you as acquiring certain seed species from Japan would definitely be appreciated by some of us. If I recall correctly, we can't aquire Japanese beech seeds in the States due to no one taking the time collect the seeds and go through the legal hoops (both Japanese and American). Do keep in mind that your target audience is already a niche part of a niche hobby in the States.

What I can do is the procedures for exporting from Japan. The procedures for importing are something that people living in the country can do.
I will abide by the laws of Japan, they will abide by the laws of their country, and we will both abide by international laws and treaties.
However, all I can do is
1. Check that there are no violations of the Washington Convention or other regulations
2. Make sure that all soil is removed from the seeds and seedlings you are sending
3. Obtain a quarantine certificate
4. Arrange for sea or air shipping and charge them the total cost
But your advice helped me understand that this idea is very difficult. Thank you very much.

 

[Hasagawa]

It was an misunderstanding on my part, not an inconvenience.
I thought you were trying to buy seeds, not sell them.
I dont buy seeds as I dont grow from seed. I dont have that kind of time left in my life, to grow a tree from seed.
However if I did, I would probably go with a reputable seller that already has seeds in the U.S. like the one I linked rather than a random unknown person from outside the country considering the import regulations and red tape that has to be followed to import legally. If something isnt followed correctly and the USDA finds out, they can come and destroy my entire collection of trees to fix whatever problem they perceive. Its just not worth the risk

Of course, this assumes that importing the seeds is legal in the country where you want to obtain them.
It takes many years to grow a tree from seed into a bonsai.
But there are ways to make it shorter.
You can also graft the branches of the grown seedlings onto an existing rootstock.
However, this idea is fine if it never becomes necessary.
There's no need to go through the trouble when you can buy it locally.
Recently, people in Japan have been arrested for importing timber and plants in violation of the Washington Convention.
I have no intention of helping such people. I just wanted to help them with the transportation if it is legal. Your advice was very helpful. Thank you very much.