Eleagnus Pungens

[NateDav]

Yesterday I went to a local nursery in search of landscape material, ended up leaving with this Silverberry. It was $23.99, however, I had coupons and ended up paying $16.49. It's got a wonderful nebari, though it will still need some work as there are some crossing roots. There is some movement in the lower 1/3 of the trunk and then after that everything is arrow straight and taperless.

From my understanding these species of shrubs/trees are vigorous and very durable, they handle rootwork and large reductions of foilage well. If its like Olea in being Mediterranean then it could probably handle summer potting and branch reduction without skipping a beat.

Thoughts on working the material at this time?
Aftercare will not be an issue.
I also want to begin working this piece of material with the input of the Bnut community.
Could be an interesting exercise to gain a different perspectives.

Its currently 26" in height with a 6.5×5.5" nebari. All the bends, interesting lines, major branches originate 4-6" up the trunk. Here are some pics.

The full monty


Nebari & Proposed Front


Proposed Rear


Left Side View (This also has potential but the nebari is lacking from this perspective)


Very Uninteresting Right Side View


Container choice (Rectangle with beveled edges)


All constructive comments, suggestions, criticisms are welcome.

 

[sorce]

Today is a good day for a beer and a Repot and 5 more beers.

Granted, I can't see what you're looking at, but there is a difference between a nice wide base, and a great Nebari. This has a nice wide base!

I wouldn't pot it yet. Better off in a basket.

Sorce

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Nice species to work with.

You are in San Antonio, and still have a month or two of hot & dry weather ahead. I would have not repot until after weather cooled down. In the future wait until daytime highs are under 90 F. for 5 out of 7 days a week. But given that the deed is done, just keep it in afternoon shade, it should be fine.

In the future you can repot in late summer or early autumn (as the weather cools) or you can wait until the end of winter, and repot just before weather warms up. In your climate this silverberry will likely be evergreen.

Coiled roots are popular in Chinese Penjing, in traditional Japanese bonsai the coiled roots would be a negative, and not considered "nebari" per se. In American Bonsai, it is up to the grower / artist whether to keep and emphasize, or de-emphasize and try to undo.

Given the age of the coiled roots, I would simply deliberately go for more of a Penjing style. Work with what you have. Use google images and see if you can see the stylistic differences that make Penjing unique from Japanese Bonsai *(technically, Japanese bonsai is derived from, came after, Chinese Penjing, Penjing is an older art form by over 1000 years). Chinese Penjing tends to be more angular, less use of wire. More free form.

Your pot choice is good. The color will compliment the flowers and the fruit.
Nice.

 

[NateDav]

@sorce Okay, lets go with wide base. Why would you use a basket? You would grow it out that much more? Or cut back and grow out again? I was also considering leaving in the nursery can and just cutting back hard. See where it is next year. Thoughts?

I prefer to keep my trees on the smaller side. Majority of what I have are between 8-16", although, I have 2 or 3 that are about 22-24".

 

[sorce]

Thoughts?

I put repottings on hold since everything was dying.

Now that I dug into a couple of these baskets after 3 some years I am absolutely convinced it's the fastest way to get a near indestructible Matt of feeders roots.

There was a BoAJ video a while back, where @Owen Reich was picking through a rootball of a pine. That is the kind of rootmass I have been seeking ever since. I've spoke about it before here. It sings of excellent cultivation for years.

Anyway, the fastest way to get to that, DE and a proper root pruning basket! No "strings" attached!
No long space wasting circular roots.

Once you have that, it's damn near impossible for a tree to revert to throwing long thick stuff, because there is no need. You might find a couple after a few years in a regular pot.

This good all around root system also aids in putting on good even top growth.

Gotta be a proper root pruning basket though. Not any old colander.

Sorce

 

[NateDav]

Nice species to work with.

You are in San Antonio, and still have a month or two of hot & dry weather ahead. I would have not repot until after weather cooled down. In the future wait until daytime highs are under 90 F. for 5 out of 7 days a week. But given that the deed is done, just keep it in afternoon shade, it should be fine.

In the future you can repot in late summer or early autumn (as the weather cools) or you can wait until the end of winter, and repot just before weather warms up. In your climate this silverberry will likely be evergreen.

Coiled roots are popular in Chinese Penjing, in traditional Japanese bonsai the coiled roots would be a negative, and not considered "nebari" per se. In American Bonsai, it is up to the grower / artist whether to keep and emphasize, or de-emphasize and try to undo.

Given the age of the coiled roots, I would simply deliberately go for more of a Penjing style. Work with what you have. Use google images and see if you can see the stylistic differences that make Penjing unique from Japanese Bonsai *(technically, Japanese bonsai is derived from, came after, Chinese Penjing, Penjing is an older art form by over 1000 years). Chinese Penjing tends to be more angular, less use of wire. More free form.

Your pot choice is good. The color will compliment the flowers and the fruit.
Nice.

Its not been repotted, pruned or anything just yet. My understanding is it reacts in similar fashion to Olives. So it should be able to handle some work this season, at least that's my opinion.

Thanks for the compliment on pot choice. I think it could be better, but I don't have anything else that would pair well with it at the moment. I like the thought of approaching it as Penjing. Cheers! Great suggestions!

 

[NateDav]

I put repottings on hold since everything was dying.

Now that I dug into a couple of these baskets after 3 some years I am absolutely convinced it's the fastest way to get a near indestructible Matt of feeders roots.

There was a BoAJ video a while back, where @Owen Reich was picking through a rootball of a pine. That is the kind of rootmass I have been seeking ever since. I've spoke about it before here. It sings of excellent cultivation for years.

Anyway, the fastest way to get to that, DE and a proper root pruning basket! No "strings" attached!
No long space wasting circular roots.

Once you have that, it's damn near impossible for a tree to revert to throwing long thick stuff, because there is no need. You might find a couple after a few years in a regular pot.

This good all around root system also aids in putting on good even top growth.

Gotta be a proper root pruning basket though. Not any old colander.

Sorce

Pond baskets are incredible for growing, I use them as well. I tend to get a few coarse ones but that is because I let them escape and run in the ground. I lift them up cut away every spring just before everything begins to flush out.

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

You know what you are doing, good plans, yes in your climate, treat it like an olive.

 

[roberthu]

I just picked up 2 locally. Similar price. I am eager to work on them but still waiting for temp to drop below 85 in the day. Mine are really dense and robust so I want to see if they flower this fall. I’d love to experience the fragrant smell if possible.

 

[roberthu]

You know what you are doing, good plans, yes in your climate, treat it like an olive.

Thanks. Treat it like an olive means repot in summer when it's actively growing? I am in Atlanta GA and it's pretty similar to where the OP is just a bit wetter I assume. Is it safe to repot now or is it better to do it in spring? I plan to do some serious root prune since mine are in deep and big nursery pots with peat based mix. I plan to get them in to inorganic soil mix in bonsai training pots that are shallower.

 

[NateDav]

Thanks. Treat it like an olive means repot in summer when it's actively growing? I am in Atlanta GA and it's pretty similar to where the OP is just a bit wetter I assume. Is it safe to repot now or is it better to do it in spring? I plan to do some serious root prune since mine are in deep and big nursery pots with peat based mix. I plan to get them in to inorganic soil mix in bonsai training pots that are shallower.

You can repot them safely in summer, with appropriate technique and aftercare. Mediterranean species thrive during the heat of summer. Olives and Pungens are pretty aggressive growers and should be able to recuperate from summer root work.

Conversely, they can be repotted in spring as well. I would wait till the time is such that there is no danger of freezing. My experience is that spring repotting tends to slow them down for a little while. I prefer summer for my Olives, Mediterranean species and Tropicals.

 

[roberthu]

You can repot them safely in summer, with appropriate technique and aftercare. Mediterranean species thrive during the heat of summer. Olives and Pungens are pretty aggressive growers and should be able to recuperate from summer root work.

Conversely, they can be repotted in spring as well. I would wait till the time is such that there is no danger of freezing. My experience is that spring repotting tends to slow them down for a little while. I prefer summer for my Olives, Mediterranean species and Tropicals.

Cool thank you for sharing!

 

[roberthu]

Any update on this tree? I just chopped mine down and am getting ready to repot.

 

[NateDav]

As mentioned in prior posts, roots were reduced to fit into this container. That was performed in the summer. I left the plant extremely long to grow the remainder of growing season. At about a month it set flowers, after which it pushed a few shoots that elongated about 12 inches.

In the fall, hard cut backs were made to develop taper and movement. They were sealed with liquid cut paste.

In February I cut the remaining leaves in half, it began to set buds for spring push. The recent prolonged freeze we experienced set it back 2 weeks. The elongating branches are from the past week.

There will be no fertilizer applied until after the first flush of growth slows down and hardens off.

 

[NateDav]

 

[NateDav]

May 2021 Update

 

[NateDav]

August 2021

Before:


After:

 

[SeanS]

Nice chunky shohin. Any chance you can get more movement into the right cascade branch? It’s very horizontal and straight.

 

[NateDav]

Nice chunky shohin. Any chance you can get more movement into the right cascade branch? It’s very horizontal and straight.

Thank you, definitely plan to wire and add a bend or two. Just don't have any at the moment.

 

[NateDav]

Had a giant leaf hopper eat half the leaves off the leader, it died back… “that’s the #bonsai-life.” A little guy wire to start lowering the cascading branch. Looks better, good thing all it’s going to take is time!