Differents seeds, stratification periods and seedling cutting technique.

[Nybonsai12]

As i'm enjoying trying to grow from seed with my tridents, i decided to try some different species but get mixed answers on stratification periods.

Instructions I received from the various sellers gave the follwoing

Japanese red pine: Scarify in hot water 24 hours, cold stratify 14-21 days and plant.

Japanese White pine: Scarify in hot water 24 hours, cold stratify 30 days and plant.

Japanese Black pine: Scarify in hot water 24 hours, cold stratify 60 days.

Japanese black pine Mikawa: Scarify in hot water 24 hours, cold stratify 30 days

Japanse maple Mikawa Yatsubusa: Scarify in hot water 24 hours, cold stratify 90 days. This one seems right.

From the reading of various sources, I get different answers regarding the stratification periods? the 30 day periods for the pines seems short, but having not done it before I am not in the know and don't have anything to compare. Of course if they started sprouting in the bag then I know it's time, but i was looking for more definitive answers.

And part two of my questions:
Is the cutting of seedling techniques to get radial roots recommended for all varieties? I would think deciduous its not as much an issue since the tree can be barerooted and roots worked, whereas a pine that would not be a recommended practice.

Thanks in advance all.

 

[cmeg1]

Black pine 60 days Is what I always do.

 

[Anthony]

NyBonsai12,

On the Black Pine and Red Pine [ test please with only a few seed ], just soak in warm water for 24 hours and plant in a sterile soil mix.
Germination is around 10 days.

I suspect the seeds are coming out of cold storage, and that satisfies the dormancy requirement.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Nybonsai12]

NyBonsai12,

On the Black Pine and Red Pine [ test please with only a few seed ], just soak in warm water for 24 hours and plant in a sterile soil mix.
Germination is around 10 days.

I suspect the seeds are coming out of cold storage, and that satisfies the dormancy requirement.
Good Day
Anthony

I wish that was the case but all seeds I received indicated cold stratification was necessary.

 

[jeanluc83]

My understanding is for black pine cold stratification is not necessary but increases consistency of germination. They will sprout without it but germination will be sporadic through out the spring. Stratified seeds will all start growing at about the same time. This is not based on experience but just what I have read.

I cold stratified my pitch pine seeds last year for about 40 days with good success. My method was to soak the seeds for 3 days, discard the floaters and wrap the rest in I damp paper towel and put in a bag in the fridge.

I would say that if you can do proper cold stratification do it. If anything you may wish you had later if you don't.

 

[Nybonsai12]

I'm bumping this to see if I can get an answer to the seedling cutting technique question in my original post.

I know it applies to black pine, but what about red and white? With the red will the stem change color to violet? And since white is slower growing how does that factor in? I got red pine seeds sprouting and will need to get this going soon so it's not a waste of time.

 

[tmmason10]

your red pines are already getting close to time for the seedling technique? Seems pretty early. I haven't done red pine unfortunately but I have some growing from last year. Thr times I have sprouted pines I scarified them and sowed them around now, then put them outside under the bench. I havent cold stratified them per say but they were outside in 20-40 degree weather for a month or so.

 

[Nybonsai12]

The majority of the red are just sprouting, one is further ahead and will need cutting soon so I figured I'd try to find out if I am to wait for the stem to change to a violet or not?
Everything is early because I'm starting them inside to give a longer first growing season. I don't know if that will be a good or bad thing yet.

My black and white pines seeds are just going to be first planted next week or so. They should be closer to a normal schedule. The Red required less than a month stratification so I figured I'd give it a shot early.