Considering to grow a Snow Rose mostly indoors (From seed)

[Bonsai_Rookie]

Hello everyone!

I am new to bonsai business and I am currently considering to attempt to grow a Snow Rose Bonsai mostly indoors **FROM THE SEED**.

Location challenges: Canada, Quebec, close to Ottawa.

Temperature:
Constant around 68 degrees fahrenheit and 77 degrees fahrenheit (except in winter, but I will have a heater)

We can have harsh winters here in Canada, so my bonsai would be kept indoors all automn and winter to avoid getting damaged or even die. During spring and summer, I could manage to bring it outside (probably at a shady spot) to absorb raw sunlight several hours almost everyday.


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I can give as much artificial light hours inside as it would need (I would like your thoughts on how much light it would need).

Plus, I do have the red-spectrum version of the LED light bulbs as well, which I know helps triggering flowering. I may consider buying the blue-spectrum versions too (for foliage growth).

Wind and humidity:
As for the wind, I will have 2 small fans blowing lightly and constantly on the pots everyday, since their location would be in my basement (I know this is not ideal, but that's the best I can do ) to avoid fungal/rot/moss growth.

As for the humidity, I would need to check it personally with a humidity checker, but my shower leads directly to my room (which means everyday I shower, the room's humidity increases a little).

I also have a humidity tray filled with pebbles that I can fill up woth water under the pot (without the pot touching water directly ofc) to increase the surrounding humidity around the plant.

Soil composition:
-Pot would be probably an 8-inch pot, classic.

I don't know much about the Snow Rose's likings about soil (only that it likes coarse soils) compositions, and they may differ since we all have different set-ups and locations, so I will consider the best soil composition suggestions from you guys for my situation.

Fertilizer:
I will make some further researches about the recommended fertilization. and dosage for this specie (of course it also depends on the type of fertilizer).

Pests and diseases:
I will make some further researches about those as well.

Watering:
I have easy access to both tap water and source water (from mountains). Depending on its likings, I will choose one or alternate between the two, further research required.

Lastly, if you really think it seems impossible for me to grow a Snow Rose in these conditions, I would gladly appreciate if you could provide the reasons why, as well as suggest an alternative specie that would probably suit my conditions better (if possible, I'd like another specie of flowering bonsai )

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Everything looks great... however you didn't answer the big question: "why?"

What are you hoping to accomplish? Do you want to sell small snow roses? Do you just like the plant and want to grow a lot of them?

I have never heard of anyone growing them from seed, so I would be curious how you do. However let me just say that snow roses are grown by the millions in tropical nurseries for pennies a plant. You might find that it is much faster just to buy snow roses commercially, and get a five year head-start (versus growing from seed).

 

[Bonsai_Rookie]

Everything looks great... however you didn't answer the big question: "why?"

What are you hoping to accomplish? Do you want to sell small snow roses? Do you just like the plant and want to grow a lot of them?

I have never heard of anyone growing them from seed, so I would be curious how you do. However let me just say that snow roses are grown by the millions in tropical nurseries for pennies a plant. You might find that it is much faster just to buy snow roses commercially, and get a five year head-start (versus growing from seed).

Simply to start it all by my own! For the joy of taking care of it from the very start, shape it to my likings, to hopefully make a masterpiece from it and hope it will last several decades

I didn't mention it, but that would be my second attempt, my first attempt with a purple flower jacaranda was a disaster (but it was my first time, all by myself )

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I am glad your jacaranda was a failure... because it would probably cause you nothing but heartache. Not an easy tree to grow in landscape... and almost impossible as bonsai.

Why don't you try a bunch of different species and see what works best in your setup? That way if your snow roses don't do well, you have other options. Chinese elm is great starter tree that grows indoors pretty well, and seed is broadly available.

 

[Bonsai_Rookie]

What type of soil mix would be the best for the Snow Rose and my current set-up?

Also, how much artificial light (how many hours/day) should I give it? Maybe also what spectrum? I'm thinking about 2 bulbs blue wavelenght and 4 bulbs full spectrum

 

[penumbra]

What type of soil mix would be the best for the Snow Rose and my current set-up?

Also, how much artificial light (how many hours/day) should I give it? Maybe also what spectrum? I'm thinking about 2 bulbs blue wavelenght and 4 bulbs full spectrum

I don't want to turn you away, and maybe you will get you answer here, but you are apparently new to plants, much less bonsai, and your very broad questions have way to many answers.
You need to determine what it is you truly want. Do you want to grow a plant or do you want to make a bonsai? My advice is to learn first to grow a plant and keep it alive.
There are too many people who like the Idea of bonsai, and the idea is not the reality. Whenever I let the word bonsai slip in public I get a lot of half backed ideas about the subject. I try not to be too much of a smart ass, but when the question is asked of me "how do I make a bonsai", my answere is frequently "do you have 30 years? Because I don't."

 

[Bonsai_Rookie]

I don't want to turn you away, and maybe you will get you answer here, but you are apparently new to plants, much less bonsai, and your very broad questions have way to many answers.
You need to determine what it is you truly want. Do you want to grow a plant or do you want to make a bonsai? My advice is to learn first to grow a plant and keep it alive.
There are too many people who like the Idea of bonsai, and the idea is not the reality. Whenever I let the word bonsai slip in public I get a lot of half backed ideas about the subject. I try not to be too much of a smart ass, but when the question is asked of me "how do I make a bonsai", my answere is frequently "do you have 30 years? Because I don't."

I do need the knowledge of basic plant caring before jumping to bonsai knowledge, but I am aware that from evolving a plant to a bonsai takes several years (sometimes decades depending on the specie).

I am ready to wait the time and provide the caring it will require. This is why I am asking for advices, to maximize my chances of success.

If you would have any additonnal informations or advices on specific caring, growing cycle and/or environment on the Snow Rose, that would be really helpful

Unless I try to grow an azalea from seed, that would also be an option to consider

 

[Bonsai_Rookie]

I will also start a chinease elm at the same time, so that if the Snow Rose is a failure, I will atleast have the classic of the classics.

 

[TinyArt]

Hello, @Bonsai_Rookie -- you've made me curious -- have you found sources for serissa seeds?

 

[Bonsai_Rookie]

I did, but only one.

Hopefully the seeds will be of good quality:

10 Seeds Serissa japonica foetida Rare Bonsai Plants Potted Home Beautiful Decor | eBay

Sowing seeds slightly pressing into the ground, sprinkle with earth on top. Keep under the hood, in a light sandy substrate, at high humidity and high temperatures (about 25 degrees), if possible, providing serissam also lower heating.

www.ebay.com

I wish I would've found another source more reliable, but most of them are out of stock

 

[penumbra]

Buying seeds from China is highly unreliable.

 

[Bonsai_Rookie]

Buying seeds from China is highly unreliable.

I totally agree, I'll look for another supplier.

Maybe I should instead try a Korean Hornbeam. Apparently, they make excellent bonsais and are way less complicated to maintain since they don't flourish

 

[Tums]

Korean hornbeam and other trees from temperature climates need a real winter dormancy and are not good candidates for growing indoors long term. Try something more tropical like a ficus, Parrot's Beak, brush cherry.

 

[Bonsai_Rookie]

Korean hornbeam and other trees from temperature climates need a real winter dormancy and are not good candidates for growing indoors long term. Try something more tropical like a ficus, Parrot's Beak, brush cherry.

What specifically makes a "winter dormancy"?

Because, here in Canada, the winter can be pretty cold, would that mean cutting off the light and heat during winter?

 

[Tums]

What specifically makes a "winter dormancy"?

Because, here in Canada, the winter can be pretty cold, would that mean cutting off the light and heat during winter?

A winter dormancy would be like leaving the tree outdoors so it experiences gradually less light and lower temperatures. The tree then needs to have a certain number of hours under 7c/45f before it's ready to wake up. If it's comfortable for you indoors, it's not cold enough to induce dormancy for a tree like a hornbeam.

 

[Bonsai_Rookie]

Hmm... besides not buying a heater, I could potentially leave it outside during automn until reaching freezing temperatures (below zero).

Right now, the tree would be in my basement (my room), it is not well heated, so it could work if it gets cold enough.

Either that and/or I put it close to a closed window for a big part of the day and hopefully get enough cold from that.

But you've got a point, I have no knowledge on this whatsoever. It will be a challenge, and I love challenges

 

[penumbra]

I would forget the seed right now and buy a small plant like a ficus and begin your learning process. It is the wrong time of the year to mess with seeds unless it is to collect them. And bare in mind that many, if not most, temperate zone tree seeds require cold stratification and many require warm and then cold stratification. The process can be a month or 5 months depending on species.
I have been growing plants for 60 years and I still have more seed germination failures than I do successes. I think that finding good viable seed can be a challenge. I split a group of 800 Japanese Maple seeds from several different cultivars with a friend of mine. Of m group of 400+ I had 56 germinate and grow. My friend had one grow. Certainly a seed source problem, but obviously there is more than that.
There are challenges but there is also absurdity. I have tried both.

 

[HorseloverFat]

It’s not SIMPLY a matter of “challenging”... “tricking nature“ is EXCEEDINGLY difficult, and in MANY MANY cases.. impossible.

What zone are you in? I’m pretty cold myself.... and even native/endemic trees/plants are a challenge In containers...

With Coldframes (a reasonably worked “set-up”), even, I can Only support one-two USDA zones UP (species dependent).

Sounds like you are very excited, and have TONS of “lil bits” of information forming the structure of your plan. ...take a breath.

For your “dormancy needing” (temperate) trees, grow species that live outdoors and candle handle your climate...

For indoors... grow species (LIKE Serissa Japonica, like you said) That are notoriously suited for those conditions. Ficus and the usual suspects..

For someone starting out their horticultural AND bonsai journeys... survival of SUITED-TO-YOUR situation trees... will be challenge enough.

I wish you nothing but luck!!

(Go ficus, serissa, bougie, poms (wintered) indoors, and get some winter-friendly beasts for outdoors... PLENTY of great ones!)

 

[TinyArt]

Check your local library for books on bonsai, if you haven't already. There are so many available to buy new and especially used, that it's nice to spend time with them before spending money. (abe.com, amazon, and ebay are worth checking for the out-of-print stuff)

I borrowed -- and decided to buy -- Brooklyn Botanic Garden's Growing Bonsai Indoors, from 2013.* The "encyclopedia of bonsai for indoors" lists 24 species with tips for growing and styling each. (In my case, it helps me to know what bonsai-suitable species will survive my climate & my beginner care!) Around US$5 used.

*Lighting solutions have come a long way since then -- plenty of info to search on here, but you can start with this current thread (which you've probably seen...) https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/grow-setup-for-at-the-office.51121/#post-882642

Best wishes for your success!

 

[HorseloverFat]

Check your local library for books on bonsai, if you haven't already. There are so many available to buy new and especially used, that it's nice to spend time with them before spending money. (abe.com, amazon, and ebay are worth checking for the out-of-print stuff)

I borrowed -- and decided to buy -- Brooklyn Botanic Garden's Growing Bonsai Indoors, from 2013.* The "encyclopedia of bonsai for indoors" lists 24 species with tips for growing and styling each. (In my case, it helps me to know what bonsai-suitable species will survive my climate & my beginner care!) Around US$5 used.

*Lighting solutions have come a long way since then -- plenty of info to search on here, but you can start with this current thread (which you've probably seen...) https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/grow-setup-for-at-the-office.51121/#post-882642

Best wishes for your success!

“Plus one” for that book... it’s been a very useful tool, for me, ESPECIALLY so during my first year of “TinyTrees”.