Black veins on Chinese Elm leaves please help me figure this out

[power270lb]

I can't find anything regarding this and it's tripping me out. 5-7 leaves a day turn yellow overnight and drop. Posted about it before and attributes it to new growth replacing old growth but it's new growth too and sporadic. The leaves aren't dry but hard almost not "leafy" very crisp but different from when they were dry. Now these black veins and some have faint black spots. Very faint on some of the yellow leaves. I don't get it, two weeks ago this tree was thriving growing out of control. Just trying to not kill a tree.

 

[Mikecheck123]

What's your setup like? Where do you live? Where do you keep the tree?

Luckily these are hard to kill.

 

[Esolin]

Black spots seems like it might be fungal, but yes, more info would be helpful. How wet is the soil? How much sun does it get? Is it kept inside our outside? Was it recently moved? etc... More pics of the tree would be good too.

 

[power270lb]

Black spots seems like it might be fungal, but yes, more info would be helpful. How wet is the soil? How much sun does it get? Is it kept inside our outside? Was it recently moved? etc... More pics of the tree would be good too.

@Mikecheck123 So I received this in early December and it came dry so I watered and it bounced back. Grew well but branches were long and thin so I trimmed it and planted the cuttings. All the cuttings rooted and are in their own pots now. After that the tree grew out of control, branches weeping out past the bowl, so I trimmed back again. It's currently in a setup that has 3 spider farmer SF-1000s enclosed in mylar curtains with mylar everywhere.
The soil it came with looks to be a combo of akadama, lava, fir bark and some kind of organic soil. I honestly can't figure out specifically what it is because it dries really fast and it's very fine. I know what garden soil feels like and this isn't it. I put a skewer in and check daily and it's not moist so I've been watering every 24-36 hours and the tree has thrived to this point. It's more the black veins I'm worried about.
Before it was growing so fast the leaves were very reddish then would turn green. Now, they're reddish and turn yellow then drop. My setup has a humidifier, a fan and I have 50+ lbs of Diatomaceous Earth, lava rock, pumice and fir bark if I need to do a repot. It's crazy how fast it dries. Idk if I need to water almost twice? Does that make sense indoors? Every tree I pull the skewer out and you can feel moisture. The elm is consistently drier than all.

 

[Bnana]

Sounds like the humidity is very high. It's there proper ventilation and air movement?
Fungus like this normally means the conditions are not right. I would just place it outside.

 

[power270lb]

Sounds like the humidity is very high. It's there proper ventilation and air movement?
Fungus like this normally means the conditions are not right. I would just place it outside.

I plan to once frost has disappeared but it's currently 28 and windy in Bayonne, NJ

 

[Mikecheck123]

@Mikecheck123 So I received this in early December and it came dry so I watered and it bounced back. Grew well but branches were long and thin so I trimmed it and planted the cuttings. All the cuttings rooted and are in their own pots now. After that the tree grew out of control, branches weeping out past the bowl, so I trimmed back again. It's currently in a setup that has 3 spider farmer SF-1000s enclosed in mylar curtains with mylar everywhere.
The soil it came with looks to be a combo of akadama, lava, fir bark and some kind of organic soil. I honestly can't figure out specifically what it is because it dries really fast and it's very fine. I know what garden soil feels like and this isn't it. I put a skewer in and check daily and it's not moist so I've been watering every 24-36 hours and the tree has thrived to this point. It's more the black veins I'm worried about.
Before it was growing so fast the leaves were very reddish then would turn green. Now, they're reddish and turn yellow then drop. My setup has a humidifier, a fan and I have 50+ lbs of Diatomaceous Earth, lava rock, pumice and fir bark if I need to do a repot. It's crazy how fast it dries. Idk if I need to water almost twice? Does that make sense indoors? Every tree I pull the skewer out and you can feel moisture. The elm is consistently drier than all.

Looks perfectly normal to me. Sometimes they drop leaves like that.

You're way over thinking the watering. Do it once per day and relax. Make sure you're getting water to drain out the bottom each time and not doing "veneer watering" where you just splash the top of the soil.

I also wouldn't read too much into the pause in growth. Sometimes they grow and sometimes they pause.

Do get it outside when it's warm enough.

 

[jeremy_norbury]

This is normal - it's spring - they change their leaves now.

 

[power270lb]

Looks perfectly normal to me. Sometimes they drop leaves like that.

You're way over thinking the watering. Do it once per day and relax. Make sure you're getting water to drain out the bottom each time and not doing "veneer watering" where you just splash the top of the soil.

I also wouldn't read too much into the pause in growth. Sometimes they grow and sometimes they pause.

Do get it outside when it's warm enough.

I let it run through when I water. Is it better to bottom water?

 

[Tieball]

Water running through is better. I had back spots and black veins on Chinese Elms before. It was a fungus problem. I treated it with a spray and making sure it has plenty of air movement. I found in my case that if left untreated the new leaves developed the same problem...so a sprayed with a broad fungus control spray. It took a few weeks to cure...but it did happen. Generally I think all the leaves were replaced by new leaves. I think the lack of air movement, spring moisture (a lot of wetness) and not enough sun (the trees were behind others that shaded the area). I made adjustments. It worked for me.

 

[Mikecheck123]

I let it run through when I water. Is it better to bottom water?

No. You want water running through the roots to inject air into the soil.

 

[power270lb]

No. You want water running through the roots to inject air into the soil.

Copy that, that's what I've been doing. Read up on bottom watering and how it encourages roots to grow down. Always like to hear other people's opinions.

 

[power270lb]

Water running through is better. I had back spots and black veins on Chinese Elms before. It was a fungus problem. I treated it with a spray and making sure it has plenty of air movement. I found in my case that if left untreated the new leaves developed the same problem...so a sprayed with a broad fungus control spray. It took a few weeks to cure...but it did happen. Generally I think all the leaves were replaced by new leaves. I think the lack of air movement, spring moisture (a lot of wetness) and not enough sun (the trees were behind others that shaded the area). I made adjustments. It worked for me.

Doing the same, sprayed once and plan to again.

 

[power270lb]

Water running through is better. I had back spots and black veins on Chinese Elms before. It was a fungus problem. I treated it with a spray and making sure it has plenty of air movement. I found in my case that if left untreated the new leaves developed the same problem...so a sprayed with a broad fungus control spray. It took a few weeks to cure...but it did happen. Generally I think all the leaves were replaced by new leaves. I think the lack of air movement, spring moisture (a lot of wetness) and not enough sun (the trees were behind others that shaded the area). I made adjustments. It worked for me.

Seems to have recovered. Tbh I was watering daily and it was flourishing, then I stopped to every other and turns out that was the problem. I sprayed with neem as well so maybe a combo of both.

 

[Deleted member 32750]

I have this same problem with my Chinese elm. They're very susceptible to black spot fungus. Try using a granular systemic fungicide as a preventative measure and spray with copper fungicide as needed/directed by the label. It seems like the major cause of this is overhead watering Chinese elms when they are pushing out new growth so I would advise against doing that until growth hardens off.

 

[power270lb]

I have this same problem with my Chinese elm. They're very susceptible to black spot fungus. Try using a granular systemic fungicide as a preventative measure and spray with copper fungicide as needed/directed by the label. It seems like the major cause of this is overhead watering Chinese elms when they are pushing out new growth so I would advise against doing that until growth hardens off.

U mean wetting the leaves?

 

[Deleted member 32750]

U mean wetting the leaves?

Yeah that’ll prevent it from spreading. To the new susceptible growth

 

[Bnana]

Keep the tree in the sun and in a location with plenty of support movement (so not in front of a wall). If the leaves aren't we to often this will go away. Some black spots are no problem, your tree can really handle that.

Using fungicides will stop it for now but won't prevent it from coming back. So that's a poor solution.