Anyone Ever Use a Standing Knife Sharpener?

[Apex37]

Curious if any of y’all have used a standing knife sharpener to sharpen your grafting knives or scissors.

Here’s the one I have that I use for the kitchen:
Mueller Knife Sharpener

I feel like this could work, but not sure.
I’m not entirely confident getting a few whetstones and sharpening my blades that way. I know that’s a quick way to ruin tools if you don’t know what you’re doing.

 

[czaczaja]

Curious if any of y’all have used a standing knife sharpener to sharpen your grafting knives or scissors.

Here’s the one I have that I use for the kitchen:
Mueller Knife Sharpener

I feel like this could work, but not sure.
I’m not entirely confident getting a few whetstones and sharpening my blades that way. I know that’s a quick way to ruin tools if you don’t know what you’re doing.

I actually heard this opinion about the sharpener you are referring to. I'm not a Japanese tool sharpening pro in any way but whetstones give me satisfactory results. Last year I got myself a HORL knife sharpener and it's pretty much foolproof.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

I ruined about 15 knives by using a "sharpener" like that. It doesn't sharpen, it shaves off a piece of metal and chips the blade itself. They are terrible at what they were designed to do.

Instead of grafting knives, consider box cutters. You don't have to sharpen those and they're way easier to carry and usually they even have a decent handle - which I haven't seen in any japanese grafting knife. They also fold up sometimes, which makes them safer to store.

I buy and use cheap scissors, so replacing them isn't a problem. But a friend of mine is an avid sharpener and he once told me: "Look man, cavepeople sharpened obsidian.. Obsidian is glass and every chip can pierce your skin as a hot knife through butter, antibiotics didn't exist, and these people did it anyways. Sure, sharpening is a skill you need to acquire, but once you can do it, you're at the same level as people were about 40.000 years ago."
Which made me reconsider getting a whetstone. But nah.

 

[The Barber]

As a barber who requires sharp razors..I use hones for my tools and they'll shave when I'm done l, but only because I already own probably 25 different stones. You don't have to go spend 1000 bucks on a Japanese stone, tools don't necessarily need a full progression all the way to 10,000 grit stones, although my chisels and carving tools get that treatment, and have ultra refined edges. Just make sure if you use a stone it is very flat and not dished. I'll try and make a video sometime of how I sharpen my bonsai tools.

A dmt, Arkansas, or old barber hone should be sufficient for most people's needs.

You'll figure out the quality of your tools in a hurry when you start sharpening them, just a heads up. It is amazing how poor the grinds are on a lot of the tools you buy are once you start removing material.

So long as you maintain the angle, a whetstone isn't so bad. You might want to practice on some cheap Chinese tools first though till you build some muscle memory.

My biggest issue with bonsai tools is that you can't disassemble them with the peened pin assembly so that you can polish the interior portion of their scissors.

 

[Weta]

I use stone even for my scalpel blades, brings me back to my sheet metal days using a file
I am a fan of those old school razor blade sharpeners for the engineering behind them.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Wouldn’t be in our toolbox. As repeated above, not the right tool for the sharpening. Get a couple stones, either oil or water (

KING KW65 1000/6000 (with naguri stone). ​

The most important bonsai tool to sharpen is one’s scissors. These are easy and fast to sharpen as they already have an edge to . Keep the angled blade(s) flat on the stone and work longitudinally down the stone until sharp. Don’t sharpen the flat side. Just stroke once lightly to knock off any burr when you are done.​

There are an awful lot of great YouTube shorts on scissors sharpening

cheers
DSD sends

 

[Ply]

Keep in mind that the tool you linked won't work for most grafting knifes. Grafting knifes, - especially the japanese / bonsai ones - tend to have a single bevel rather than a double bevel like on a knife. Put differently, a japanese grafting knife is flat on one side and has a longer angled surface on the other side, whereas a regular knife has two angled surfaces. The scissor option on the tool you linked will likely have a single bevel, but the angle is completely different from a (grafting) knife rendering it unsuitable as well.

 

[Apex37]

Thanks all! I’ll look into watching some videos on properly sharpening on a stone.
I have a whetstone that’s 1000/6000 grit, would that work? I noticed pulling it out that it had this hairline crack. Not sure if that makes it unusable or not.

 

[bwaynef]

A good flat stone that's not cupped, a steady hand, and a grafting knife is one of the easier tools to sharpen in bonsai. Its absolutely easier to do it than describe it being done. I'd prefer to use a box cutter instead of using that device (linked above) on my grafting knife.

 

[czaczaja]

Make sure to soak it thoroughly before and wet the surface during use.

 

[River's Edge]

I prefer King stones with the adjustable holders for a steadier grip on the stone and table!
combination 1,000/6,000 for most tools and scissors. The separate one is 8,000 which I use to finish my grafting knives and grafting chisels.
Having an extra one makes it simpler to keep the stones true. Be sure to dry them out between use. Thoroughly soak till bubbles stop before use.

 

[Maiden69]

Curious if any of y’all have used a standing knife sharpener to sharpen your grafting knives or scissors.

Here’s the one I have that I use for the kitchen:
Mueller Knife Sharpener

I feel like this could work, but not sure.
I’m not entirely confident getting a few whetstones and sharpening my blades that way. I know that’s a quick way to ruin tools if you don’t know what you’re doing.

I guess I'm late to the party, but the below statement is 100% accurate.

I ruined about 15 knives by using a "sharpener" like that. It doesn't sharpen, it shaves off a piece of metal and chips the blade itself.

KING KW65 1000/6000 (with naguri stone).

I prefer King stones with the adjustable holders for a steadier grip on the stone and table!

King stones are good, I prefer Suehiro, the 1000/3000 combo price was lowered recently. It comes with it's own rubber feet base and a nagura stone which it's supposed to be used for flattening but I use it to develop a little bit of slurry before I start sharpening. It is too small for flattening the stone I also have a Naniwa 6000 for polishing for my kitchen knives. For a grafting knife I think the 3000 will do great, so far I use the 1000 for scissors, and 1000/3000 for grafting knives.

One more thing you will need is a diamond trueing stone (file), they sell flattening stones, but I think that a diamond one will last a lifetime vs something that is desing to wear as it is used. I have a rubber stand like the one Frank uses for my Naniwa. Other than that the "rust erasers" are also a must have to clean up the inside (flat) side of the scissors.

And if you really want to go above and beyond, a strop will smooth the cut of your grafting knife between cuts. I heard a few people state that they put the knife trough a stone every few cuts... unnecessary, a strop will straighten the edge without the need to take material off the blade.

Lastly, if you have any rounded edge cutter, ie. concave, root cutters, knob cutters. This honing file is a must have as well.

 

[ShadyStump]

That sharpener linked in the first post (and anything like it) is the lazy person's sharpener. I don't have one in my kitchen because after years in professional cooking I have a little more regard for even my cheap knives. That sharpener is for people find their blades too dull to be useful in any capacity, want a quick edge to get on with what they were in the middle of, and then continue mistreating their equipment.

You learned enough about trees to feel like a grafting knife was a reasonable purchase.
No learn enough about grafting knives and their maintenance to prove yourself right. You'll screw it up a few times. That's why you start out with cheap tools and cheap trees.

 

[PonderingSage:]

I’ve been making knives for a number of years. I sharpen using wet dry (grey) sandpaper moving up in grit numbers as l go. I wrap the sandpaper around a block of wood and use it wet. Super easy and inexpensive.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

This is a huge subject and is akin to falling down a rabbit hole. Sorta like fertilizer and media discussions and in this case variables are once again the blistering number of products.

King stones are good,

Love the King stones myself, but there are plenty good stones on the market.

I prefer Suehiro, the 1000/3000 combo price was lowered recently. It comes with its own rubber feet base and a nagura stone which it's supposed to be used for flattening but I use it to develop a little bit of slurry before I start sharpening. It is too small for flattening the stone I also have a Naniwa 6000 for polishing for my kitchen knives. For a grafting knife I think the 3000 will do great, so far I use the 1000 for scissors, and 1000/3000 for grafting knives.

Correct, the Nagura stone is not used for truing the waterstone. The Nagura Stones are optional small stones used for preparing a slurry on water stones before sharpening, this helps you get the most out of your water stones. Best to keep the stone in water during sharpening sessions. Take out when needed and dry.

One more thing you will need is a diamond trueing stone (file), they sell flattening stones, but I think that a diamond one will last a lifetime vs something that is desing to wear as it is used.

There are a whole lot of options for whetstone flattening stones. Diamond, carbide, self-adhesive sandpaper on tempered glass or on smooth tile etc etc. The stone flattening process is most important. See video.

How to use a flattening stone.

Getting a good double sided flattening stone is key imho. This is an option for both diamond and carbide flattening stones. Why double sided?

Well, if one gets a good flattening stone for say a 1000 grit flattening stone it I’ll work incredibly well. Use the same stone on a 6000 grit whetstone and scratches will result, messing up the whetstone sharpening surface.

On the other hand, if one uses a 6000 grit flattening stone on a 6000 grit whetstone all will be well, but use the same flattening stone on a 1000 grit whetstone the entire truing process ends up taking a lot more time.

Here’s a type of double sided trueing stone for water whetstones we have. It is large, 10”/4” yet large is a plus when accurately trueing a stone. Smaller ones work fine too, but require more finesse to work best.

I have a rubber stand like the one Frank uses for my Naniwa.

These are splendid devices! Got mine out of Canada @River's Edge

Other than that the "rust erasers" are also a must have to clean up the inside (flat) side of the scissors.

One caution, be careful using rust erasers on scissors. These tools can dull one’s blades if used improperly. So please keep the flat side of the creamate or other rust eraser flat against the flat of the scissors blade and swipe outward from the pivot and back. Otherwise the eraser can rub against the blade edge and can dull the blade.

Imho Keeping the rust eraser flat is very important. Its a good reason not to use the softer style eraser as these get out of shape easily.

And if you really want to go above and beyond, a strop will smooth the cut of your grafting knife between cuts. I heard a few people state that they put the knife trough a stone every few cuts... unnecessary, a strop will straighten the edge without the need to take material off the blade.

Definately. Here’s another style, one we like best. Two sided. Largish, yet that’s good for the same reasons as for the trueing stone. Using a diamond spray saves time and can be used on both sides of the strop.

cheers
DSD sends

 

[gooeytek]

I use waterstones and paperwheels on a variable speed bench grinder for my knives. They've worked for my bonsai scissors and cutters, just have to be a little creative in the approach.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Definitely. Here’s another style, one we like best. Two sided. Largish, yet that’s good for the same reasons as for the trueing stone. Using a diamond spray saves time and can be used on both sides of the strop.

cheers
DSD sends

Ye gads! I forgot to save the two sided strop link

cheers
DSD sends

 

[Ply]

If you're going the stone route I'd say go diamond stones. Main benefits: they never go out of flat, and they're way less messy than water stones.

Either way (diamond or water), don't forget a strop and some buffing compound. Any piece of leather glued to a flat surface will do really. Buffing compound costs next to nothing and a single bar will last you about a lifetime.

A strop is really where the magic happens. That's what takes you from sharp to razor sharp, and they're really easy to use.

It's also great for bringing back that razor sharp edge to a slightly dulled tool. When woodworking, when a chisel goes a little dull I often take it back to the strop once or twice before completely resharpening it. Just 10-20 strokes on the strop and you're good to go again. At a certain point you will have to go back to the stones, but it's a great way to keep your work flow going. Cannot recommend strops enough. Cheap and they work great. (No I don't sell them).

 

[Maiden69]

some buffing compound

with the caveat, compound is completely unnecessary if you have a fine stone. All you will need this for is to remove any micro barbs that may still be on the edge. If you are just sharpening to say 1000, then yes, a decent compound will polish the edge nicely. I would then recommend 2 strops, one loaded with compound, and one just leather for the final strop.

I have this one if I want to polish the edge after the 6000 Naniwa. It works also with the 3000 Cerax, but takes a few more passes to clean up well.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07RYQD2YY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1

This one I plan on using in the future.

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[Cajunrider]

Curious if any of y’all have used a standing knife sharpener to sharpen your grafting knives or scissors.

Here’s the one I have that I use for the kitchen:
Mueller Knife Sharpener

I feel like this could work, but not sure.
I’m not entirely confident getting a few whetstones and sharpening my blades that way. I know that’s a quick way to ruin tools if you don’t know what you’re doing.

I have used something similar in the past and would not use it on my valuable knives or tools. For most blade tools, the steel at the edge is treated differently. Sharpeners like the Mueller eats away that edge way faster than necessary.

My recommendation is actually to get some diamond plates. The diamond plates stay flat so we don't have to worry about make it the stone true like the sand stones. While it will take some time to acquire the skill to sharpen things, but it is much better in the long run.